might as well just get rid of planes

Comments

  • SirBobdk
    5322 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited July 24
    FF should not ohk fighters and fighters should only be able to use mg and small bombs against infantry. Rockets should only be effective against vehicles and other planes.
  • DingoKillr
    4354 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    DingoKillr wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    And nowt changes!

    During BF3/4 and the glut of lock on's, pretend pilots were all.....

    "Get some skill and use dumb fire" which were all OHK.

    BFV has only dumb fire for infantry where all but the dedicated AA is consistently OHK but now pretend pilots are......

    "Wah, OHK is so unfair...... ".


    You're comparing two completely different scenarios.

    Stinger and Heat Seeker Missiles were there dedicated AA tools. RPG/SMAW or tank shells were more or less based on luck and/or skill. The OHK was justified there.

    In BF5, the Fliegerfaust is the dedicated AA tool, beside m/sAA. Panzerfaust, PIAT, Bazooka and Tank shells behave the same like RPG/SMAW and tank shells from BF3/4.

    The point here is, that dedicated AA tools shouldn't be OHK on planes.


    Back there in BF3, where the Stinger did 90% damage, I couldn’t care less about Stinger spam. In my best times I could dodge incoming missiles without using counter measures. The only real threats were anyway an equally skilled pilot or a mAA driver who could handle the 20mm.

    And this boys and girls, is how to miss the point.

    Learn from it.......

    If you post something that heavily smells like that you want to understand it the wrong way, deal with it, if someone corrects you. 🦆

    I've read this several times but nope, not a clue.......

    Then read again, until you get it. 🦆

    Nope, I even tried to use some additional punctuation but depending on where I put it, I got different results non of which made much sense.

    Simple fact is, anything that seriously threatens air in any effective way is immediately deemed OP by pretend pilots even when it has little overall affect on their scores.

    So in other words, you didn't get it at all. 🦆

    Frankly, no.

    We were consistently told to 'git gud' and use OHK dumb fire. Now, we are told, OHK dumb fire is OP and unfair.

    Make your mind up.

    I said dedicated AA tools shouldn't be OHK on planes. I dont see how it's that hard to understand. Things like Panzerfaust, PIAT and Bazooka still behave like RPG/SMAW in BF3 and 4.

    It's like you only read what you want to read.

    The only thing those weapons have in common is they are classed as AT in BF.
    BFV AT have significant drop compared to BF3/4 AT.

    RPG is closer to FF and yet you still need to target so you can get both groups of rockets to hit.

    Bazooka and Panzerfaust have close to none drop, especially the Bazooka which you can even zeroing like sniper rifles.

    And RPG is nowhere close to the Fliegerfaust.

    Ohh this is another snipers rifles have no drop argument.

    Did you need to adjust aim upwards for RPG at over 200m? No, but the bazooka which has the least drop of AT still needs zeroing to aim straight at a target at 200m. What do you think it would be like at 600m with that close to zero drop as you claim.

    FF has a low drop however TTL/range cuts it off before the drop impacts.


  • Frindly-Fire-4
    396 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    DingoKillr wrote: »
    DingoKillr wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    And nowt changes!

    During BF3/4 and the glut of lock on's, pretend pilots were all.....

    "Get some skill and use dumb fire" which were all OHK.

    BFV has only dumb fire for infantry where all but the dedicated AA is consistently OHK but now pretend pilots are......

    "Wah, OHK is so unfair...... ".


    You're comparing two completely different scenarios.

    Stinger and Heat Seeker Missiles were there dedicated AA tools. RPG/SMAW or tank shells were more or less based on luck and/or skill. The OHK was justified there.

    In BF5, the Fliegerfaust is the dedicated AA tool, beside m/sAA. Panzerfaust, PIAT, Bazooka and Tank shells behave the same like RPG/SMAW and tank shells from BF3/4.

    The point here is, that dedicated AA tools shouldn't be OHK on planes.


    Back there in BF3, where the Stinger did 90% damage, I couldn’t care less about Stinger spam. In my best times I could dodge incoming missiles without using counter measures. The only real threats were anyway an equally skilled pilot or a mAA driver who could handle the 20mm.

    And this boys and girls, is how to miss the point.

    Learn from it.......

    If you post something that heavily smells like that you want to understand it the wrong way, deal with it, if someone corrects you. 🦆

    I've read this several times but nope, not a clue.......

    Then read again, until you get it. 🦆

    Nope, I even tried to use some additional punctuation but depending on where I put it, I got different results non of which made much sense.

    Simple fact is, anything that seriously threatens air in any effective way is immediately deemed OP by pretend pilots even when it has little overall affect on their scores.

    So in other words, you didn't get it at all. 🦆

    Frankly, no.

    We were consistently told to 'git gud' and use OHK dumb fire. Now, we are told, OHK dumb fire is OP and unfair.

    Make your mind up.

    I said dedicated AA tools shouldn't be OHK on planes. I dont see how it's that hard to understand. Things like Panzerfaust, PIAT and Bazooka still behave like RPG/SMAW in BF3 and 4.

    It's like you only read what you want to read.

    The only thing those weapons have in common is they are classed as AT in BF.
    BFV AT have significant drop compared to BF3/4 AT.

    RPG is closer to FF and yet you still need to target so you can get both groups of rockets to hit.

    Bazooka and Panzerfaust have close to none drop, especially the Bazooka which you can even zeroing like sniper rifles.

    And RPG is nowhere close to the Fliegerfaust.

    Ohh this is another snipers rifles have no drop argument.

    Did you need to adjust aim upwards for RPG at over 200m? No, but the bazooka which has the least drop of AT still needs zeroing to aim straight at a target at 200m. What do you think it would be like at 600m with that close to zero drop as you claim.

    FF has a low drop however TTL/range cuts it off before the drop impacts.

    A multi projectile with a detinition radius that cover a large area is not like a singel projectile , Non had any problem with a one direct hit kill from a single projectile, but fliger is not a single projectile and thats why we need it to get fixed.
  • fragnstein
    839 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    I have seen pilots in chat telling other players to not take a plane of they aren't any good at it, saying that only bad salty pilots man the AA. I have seen pilots who get shot down by AA call the AA user salty.

    You say the air is filled with fireworks after the patch, its because before it was ineffective. Planes would face tank AA fire and always come away victorious. Nobody wants to waste their time using something ineffective. Why do so many pilots use rockets now, unlike before? Because they are effective.

    For the record, I think SAA/MAA could use a range reduction, but at the same time so should rockets or at least have more deviation when fired from afar.
  • SirBobdk
    5322 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member


    Why do so many pilots use rockets now, unlike before? Because they are effective.
    Because you have to use long range weapons due to the range of AA/MAA.
    And bombs have been nefed and are almost useless now.
    You cant use mg since you have to get close to ground and risk being ohk by FF.
  • Terminator000001
    1002 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited July 24
    DingoKillr wrote: »
    Ohh this is another snipers rifles have no drop argument.

    Because they literally haven't.
    Did you need to adjust aim upwards for RPG at over 200m? No, but the bazooka which has the least drop of AT still needs zeroing to aim straight at a target at 200m. What do you think it would be like at 600m with that close to zero drop as you claim.

    FF has a low drop however TTL/range cuts it off before the drop impacts.

    You can still hit with the Bazooka at very long ranges without zeroing it.
  • DavTan
    863 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Can you stop calling it a ohk , it's totally inaccurate.
    The fligal shoots 2 salvos ( albeit with one trigger press) but thats still 2 shots and all of them have to hit.
    In fact the gap between the two salvos is long enough that with a flick of the stick you can space them roughly 20degrees apart... And sometimes you have to in order to hit a fighter moving fast.
  • Man_ILoveFishing
    406 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    DavTan said:
    Can you stop calling it a ohk , it's totally inaccurate.
    The fligal shoots 2 salvos ( albeit with one trigger press) but thats still 2 shots and all of them have to hit.
    In fact the gap between the two salvos is long enough that with a flick of the stick you can space them roughly 20degrees apart... And sometimes you have to in order to hit a fighter moving fast.
    So you are saying that it's not possible to ohk with it?
  • AngrySquid270
    151 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    DavTan said:
    Can you stop calling it a ohk , it's totally inaccurate.
    The fligal shoots 2 salvos ( albeit with one trigger press) but thats still 2 shots and all of them have to hit.
    In fact the gap between the two salvos is long enough that with a flick of the stick you can space them roughly 20degrees apart... And sometimes you have to in order to hit a fighter moving fast.
    So you are saying that it's not possible to ohk with it?
    He's arguing that it's a burst weapon, so it's misleading to call it a 'OHK' weapon.  DavTan is #17 in the world with FF kills - I suspect he's quite familiar with what the FF can and can't do.

    The Breda is a 4rd burst gun which is lethal if all rounds hit.  Yet, no one calls the Breda on burst fire mode 'OHK'.

    If the FF was made a semi-auto (retaining 214RPM limit and 2salvo mag) instead of brust it'd no longer be 'OHK' by even the laziest of definitions yet the FF would be even better than it is now.

    It'd be more accurate to refer to the FF as a OBK weapon (one burst kill) than OHK.


  • Man_ILoveFishing
    406 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Sure, i did already 100 kills today with flieger, i know very well how it handles.
  • iamwiener
    378 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited July 25
    SirBobdk said:
    Because you have to use long range weapons due to the range of AA/MAA.
    And bombs have been nefed and are almost useless now.
    You cant use mg since you have to get close to ground and risk being ohk by FF.

    Seems like many other pilots seem to know how to handle bombs as bombs are the only thing that kills me when using AA.
    Tbh the more I read here, I do not see pilots arguing against the Fliegerfaust but a small group of players whose very own gaming style is disturbed. You are either not willing or not able to adapt. You keep on telling everyone who is not supporting your idea of an op ohk FF that they have no knowledge but choose to ignore their point of view. In a conquest game with 64 players in total, you probably have around 60 players who think that you are disturbing, annoying, useless etc. But thats not of your interest, isn't it?
    A analogue request to yours would be: "remove planes from BF and replace them with scripted to keep the "war atmosphere" ... they are useless and often not part of any teamplay anyway. This would be an absurd demand although it 100% reflects what probably most think about pilots.

    Can you please stop that? If you don't see the probem, actually willing to even try, you are no better. You are atm coloring this hardly. Give feedback that its not true.
    I even sent you a pm so we could have a neutral discussion helping to understand eachother. So plz don't tell us "we are not willing to even try" to understand your point.
  • xKusagamix
    1199 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited July 25
    Even as an average pilot, i'm totally fine about the Fliegerfaust right now, flying low to get highest accuracy or low bombs dropping time should be a reward but it should also come with the risk of taking hit by the FF. People abusing Rockets on planes so just getting used to be shot down by the FF.

    But the SAA/MAA range is just ridiculous now, Fighters plane has rockets, higher maneuver and speed, smaller target but in the other hand not all Bombers/Attack planes has rocket, and some of their "rockets" (like the Stuka) are not that effect at range and some of their bomb has a ridiculous dropping time, so they'll need to rely on low flying with less maneuver and lower speed than the Fighters have taken the most disavantage with the current AA ranges, in some situations (that never happen before that patch) it's nearly impossible to even get to a point and dropping bombs because you're already been shot at spawn base, and there always a few FF awaiting.

    Battlefield is a combined arms game, there should balance for everything, not just because something is ridiculous OP so you need an OP thing to counter and leave the rest untoch. FF should stay, SAA/MAA's range need to be reduce (and maybe get a damage buff), rockets should be less effective at range and less blast radius (so it'll more of a tool to counter vehicle instead of infantry), Bombers should have higher sky ceiling, bigger bombs with bigger blast radius (with less bomb, ofcourse) to be effect at a single point or vehicles instead of a being a carpet bomber.

    It's all DICE fault at balancing the game, they created the rockets which not only effective at vehilce, but also infantry in a Fighter plane (which it main role was to counter bombers) like the G6, people complaining so instead of fixing the rocket, they buffed the SAA/MAA and FF to be more effective at dealing with Fighter planes at range while the Bombers remain untouch.

    As someone said why people are now abusing the rockets, it's not because they're effective, it's because rockets are the only thing that effective with the current AA range. Pacific planes could destroy tank with 1 bombing pass just like before so why people are now using rockets more than bombs, just think about it.
  • Celsi_GER
    929 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Sure, i did already 100 kills today with flieger, i know very well how it handles.

    Last time I checked your stats
    Sure, i did already 100 kills today with flieger, i know very well how it handles.

    71 kills. That's not even near 100.

    The day before yesterday I checked your stats to see if you even use FF. You had 56 Fliegerfaust kills.
    Today you have 127 FF kills.

    Excellent example how some pilots exaggerate / manipulate the truth to make their point. Same happens in the discussion about Fliegerfaust OHK being rare or not.
  • DingoKillr
    4354 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    DingoKillr wrote: »
    Ohh this is another snipers rifles have no drop argument.

    Because they literally haven't.
    Did you need to adjust aim upwards for RPG at over 200m? No, but the bazooka which has the least drop of AT still needs zeroing to aim straight at a target at 200m. What do you think it would be like at 600m with that close to zero drop as you claim.

    FF has a low drop however TTL/range cuts it off before the drop impacts.

    You can still hit with the Bazooka at very long ranges without zeroing it.

    Right, players got HS in BF3/4 well over 3000m, yet in BFV can only get half that.

    Adjusting aim by either aiming higher or zeroing is still counting for drop.
  • A_al_K_pacino_A
    1143 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Sure, i did already 100 kills today with flieger, i know very well how it handles.

    Tbh I'm not really in this thread and my opinion is it should not be OHK. 90 damage is plenty and in reality you get less than that most of the time anyway as I'm sure you know looking at your reports (always allowing for bft inaccuracy). I went from the top so I might have missed some magic.

    Pacific Storm - 4 kills in 12 mins with the FF
    Wake - 6 kills in 8 mins
    Al Sun - 0 kills in the 3 mins you had it equipped.
    Hamada - 1 kill in 11 minutes

    11 kills over 4 rounds and over half an hour of use.
  • SirBobdk
    5322 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    iamwiener said:
    SirBobdk said:
    Because you have to use long range weapons due to the range of AA/MAA.
    And bombs have been nefed and are almost useless now.
    You cant use mg since you have to get close to ground and risk being ohk by FF.

    . You keep on telling everyone who is not supporting your idea of an op ohk FF that they have no knowledge but choose to ignore their point of view.  

    Have you read my post in the other thread about the FF. I have never said it was OP because it's not when you look at all planes.
    On the contrary, I have said that FF should have faster reload, speed and more ammo to spawn with.
    FF is only effective against fighters.
    I'm just saying that FF should not ohk fighters, but still have a buff.
  • Terminator000001
    1002 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    DingoKillr wrote: »
    DingoKillr wrote: »
    Ohh this is another snipers rifles have no drop argument.

    Because they literally haven't.
    Did you need to adjust aim upwards for RPG at over 200m? No, but the bazooka which has the least drop of AT still needs zeroing to aim straight at a target at 200m. What do you think it would be like at 600m with that close to zero drop as you claim.

    FF has a low drop however TTL/range cuts it off before the drop impacts.

    You can still hit with the Bazooka at very long ranges without zeroing it.

    Right, players got HS in BF3/4 well over 3000m, yet in BFV can only get half that.

    Adjusting aim by either aiming higher or zeroing is still counting for drop.

    BF5 maps are just half the size and those who are bigger, are clustered with cover. The only map where you could probably do headshots beyond 1.000m is Wake Island, sitting on the carrier and trying to hit something on the C flag.
  • Loqtrall
    12468 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    SirBobdk wrote: »
    Infantry can't ohk tanks so why should they ohk planes.

    I can definitely sneak up on an unexpectant tank, drop 3 dynamite on him, throw a bundle at the dynamite, and destroy him from 100 health before he even knows I'm there. That's from 100 health to 0 in an instant on the bulkiest and slowest moving targets in the game.

    I don't see how that's much different from someone with a FF, lying in wait for a plane, landing an entire barrage on critical points and destroying what is literally the fastest moving target in the game. Especially when that target in question can drop a bomb on a contested objective and have the potential kill more enemy players than a tanker or infantryman could with several rounds of ordinance fired - mostly via splash damage alone. Especially when said target can fly around the map, sneak up on ground armor from the tippy top of the sky box, and OHK or damn near OHK them in one pass.

    And that's just completely aside the fact that naturally and logically planes just have less armor than tanks, and that unlike AT equipment the FF literally has NO other use. You can fire it at literally anything else in the game and do barley any damage at all. You can direct hit an enemy infantry with an entire barrage and it won't do 100 damage.

    At that point its criticism aimed at the FF being irregularly effective at literally the one thing it's capable of doing.

    That's like saying "I can't OHK headshot someone with a Thompson, so why can people do it with a rifle" while ignoring you can run around with the Thompson and a 50 round drum mag absolutely bullet hosing people from the hip in CQB with literally the second fastest full auto ttk in the game.
  • Loqtrall
    12468 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    (Quote)
    Nope it`s a proven fact. 

    So are you, at this point, just actively parading your opinions around as facts?
  • Frindly-Fire-4
    396 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
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