Racism...

«1
TheRealMofoG
3 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
edited February 5
I was looking at other people posts about the racist people who play this game and how they experienced racism in game while playing , and literally everyone who answered basically just said that we should look the other way. I know online games are full of kids, specially battlefield, but people like me should really have to play the game without having to close the chat because someone is calling me this or that, i'm black and having to see that unexplained hate going around like it's normal, it's really sad. I get that some people are trolls, and they're stupid but something has to change , i've never heard about someone being banned for racism, that needs to change. When many of you guys get that this is actually a real problem and not just something that just because happens often should be considered normal , then maybe EA and other game companies will start doing something. Yes i can close the chat, but that's not the point, yes i can ignore them, but that's also not the point. I just felt like i should post this here because it just happened to me and i reported the guy and i'd like to share my point of view.

Comments

  • kAn3_R4nd4g10
    5 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    If you take so seriously what people say in chat, the web will be a bad place for you to be. Maybe you just don't know, but most of people troll and shittalk 24/7, and triggered people are fun (especially to them).
  • CS-2107
    1503 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    You can deactivate the chat, so you don't see it anymore. Unfortunally there is nothing else anyone can do about it, as people who take the time to write racist comments instead of playing the video game, probably won't read this post. And even if they do, I don't think that will stop them. It is like trying to tell a criminal to not be criminal, because its illegal. He knows, but he doesn't care, so it's a waste of time to try it that way.
    While I fully agree that racism doesn't belong into a video game, or the world for that matter, but there is just nothing anyone can do about its existence... Just don't take them too seriously, or deactivate the chat.
  • xBCxSEALxTEAMx6
    1303 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    What a shame, and i say that sincerely, being i see this is your first post, and for you to come here for that reasoning you must have been, and rightfully, upset. I play on consoles, and i remember in last gens infancy, i was playing with a mic, and COD WaW, and started to hear a lot of that alt right banter. One kid (sounded like he was 16), even seemed to try and recruit into his aryan organization, with other young people biting the bait.

    Not too long after, i just disengaged the mic, set my settings to "friends only", and so, i cant hear in game chat, we don't have written chat, and cannot get messages from anyone but my friends. BEST thing i ever did, and still today, a decade later, same deal. I just can't believe they can't have people do that in this day and age on a PC platform.

    To the extent you may say it's not the point, very true, and i can't imagine in today like enviornments, what i would have to hear going on now. I just sincerely don't know what they can do, unless they have personnel in the servers, hearing the chat themselves, and banning the folks making the statements, that i assume goes against TOS.
  • SmokeDawgie
    8 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    I was looking at other people posts about the racist people who play this game and how they experienced racism in game while playing , and literally everyone who answered basically just said that we should look the other way. I know online games are full of kids, specially battlefield, but people like me should really have to play the game without having to close the chat because someone is calling me this or that, i'm black and having to see that unexplained hate going around like it's normal, it's really sad. I get that some people are trolls, and they're stupid but something has to change , i've never heard about someone being banned for racism, that needs to change. When many of you guys get that this is actually a real problem and not just something that just because happens often should be considered normal , then maybe EA and other game companies will start doing something. Yes i can close the chat, but that's not the point, yes i can ignore them, but that's also not the point. I just felt like i should post this here because it just happened to me and i reported the guy and i'd like to share my point of view.

    Screenshot your chat box and send it to DICE, EA, and (if you are on console) xbox / playstation.
    It's all you can really do except for knowing that they are worthless excuses for humans.
  • WhiteMaleMurican
    3 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Here are some things YOU can do:

    1. Stop being so sensitive.
    2. Stop policing other people's right to express their thoughts or opinions, no matter how offensive YOU may find them to be.
    3. Hide chat
    4. Embrace liberty instead of trying to squash it
    5. Take responsibility for yourself and stop trying to change other people
    6. Stop using your race as an excuse to be oppressed. Rise above it.

  • xBCxSEALxTEAMx6
    1303 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Here are some things YOU can do:

    1. Stop being so sensitive.
    2. Stop policing other people's right to express their thoughts or opinions, no matter how offensive YOU may find them to be.
    3. Hide chat
    4. Embrace liberty instead of trying to squash it
    5. Take responsibility for yourself and stop trying to change other people
    6. Stop using your race as an excuse to be oppressed. Rise above it.

    There is no excuse, nor is it allowed to have racist banter in our games according to TOS. Nobody is going to accept Fascism and bigoted banter, nor should they, and to the extent they can ban them, or you, they should, and will.

    I'm an older one and been around the block a couple few. There is no "freedom of speech" when it comes to private companies. Your boss will throw you out, a store will (no matter what you may buy) as will the game, if you do not follow the rules, just like you have the right to throw someone out of your own home, for whatever reason.

    So, nobodies just going to "accept" it. YOU'RE going to accept, following the TOS, or get banned. Have a good night.
  • Forkbeard84
    1490 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    And who is going to decide what is racist and what needs to be censored? Therein lies the problem because as soon as you give one group the power to decide what should be censored, you open the door to having your own freedoms taken away. That's why "Freedom of Speech is the right to express opinions without censorship or restraint." Give me the unfiltered speech and I'll listen to what I want to. And at the same time, I'll say what I want to and you don't have to listen. That's freedom of speech.

    Many of the people asking for censorship these days should be careful of what they wish for. They are opening the door to oppression.
  • xBCxSEALxTEAMx6
    1303 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    And who is going to decide what is racist and what needs to be censored? Therein lies the problem because as soon as you give one group the power to decide what should be censored, you open the door to having your own freedoms taken away. That's why "Freedom of Speech is the right to express opinions without censorship or restraint." Give me the unfiltered speech and I'll listen to what I want to. And at the same time, I'll say what I want to and you don't have to listen. That's freedom of speech.

    Many of the people asking for censorship these days should be careful of what they wish for. They are opening the door to oppression.

    Well the thing of it is (i'm saying this sincerely), is that, there never has been Freedom of Speech when it comes to business. We in the states still have the FCC as an example, with monitors who determine what can be broadcasted on tv and radio (providing its not satellite or cable). It's been like that for literally many decades.

    Freedom of Speech, is what Government provides, in that you can't be arrested by them for it. Not that you can't be thrown out of an establishment (that happens every day with protesters or customers not following decorum) or out of a job, or forum, or game, or otherwise civilly liable for that speech, if its determined to slander or hurt others.

    Personally, i never heard these Freedom of Speech arguments of this type on games and the like, or the expectancy of, until you go to social media thinking folks have these "Rights".

    And what folks don't understand, is there are Moderators who make the determinations on Games, Forums, or Facebook, or You Tube and the like. They have TOS folks have to follow, and have folks who monitor and make those determinations.

    So, it's not a slippery slope at all when you're dealing with private entities.

    You have to simply treat it as, you're on someone elses property (like, their servers), and in that proprietors of that property that determine what proper conduct is. Of course, there's no forcing anybody to play certain games, or any games. Or work at certain establishments with rules you may not like.
  • TheRealMofoG
    3 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    You can literally call me whatever you want, but when it comes to racism then it's different. I'm just saying that EA and other game companies will only start doing something if they really see that we actually want that to be out of the gaming environment, if it keeps being treated like is just some normal thing that always happens and that we should just close the chat and ignore literally everyone because i can't just block a specific player , then it's going to keep happening. Some people behind screens should not be taken serious, but being naturally stupid and racist shouldn't they have to pay the price instead of me ? why do I have to just suck it up and keep my mouth shut? I know there's a feeling that nothing is going to be done to actually stop that , but that's the point, if people start complaning a lot, eventually, they're going to think to actually do something about it, to literally keep that out of Battlefield and other games.

    Thank you all for your answers, i like to understand what people think , so maybe i can change my mind and understand different opinions, thank you really, but i can't just ignore that all of this happens.
  • WhiteMaleMurican
    3 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Mean man use words that I don't like. Must stop him from talking. I'm offended. My feelings matter. You can't hurt my feelings. Ban him. Orange man bad.
  • TheRealMofoG
    3 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    So you created an account just so you can try to troll me ? bro... Also your name is whitemalemurican so i kinda know who i'd been dealing with. In this case, yes, i'm going to ignore you.
  • ronybaloney
    232 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Mean man use words that I don't like. Must stop him from talking. I'm offended. My feelings matter. You can't hurt my feelings. Ban him. Orange man bad.

    Wow. What a tool.
  • WhiteMaleMurican
    3 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    I summarize your responses and you get mad.

    Here's a concept you won't be able to comprehend: the 1st ammendment is worthless if individuals do not fight to protect it on an individual to individual basis. When individuals, such as yourselves, start advocating actively that anyone with a different opinion should be silenced, then free speech is dead.

    Free speech means a person's feelings don't matter. When you elevate a person's feelings above someone's right to say something, then forced speech replaces free speech.
  • disposalist
    8067 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    There is perhaps no worse abuse of Freedom of Speech than to use it to excuse bigotry and hatred. There is no 'right' to abuse others.

    *All* freedoms come with exclusions and limitations. Most people can self-regulate because they feel responsibility to their society, have empathy for others and know when they are being 'bad'. Even a sociopath can see what society deems acceptable and moderate their behaviour if they aren't stupid.

    Some apparently just can't work it out and need to be told when to shut the heck up for the good of us all.

    Saying "ignore it" when it comes to things like racism is like saying "Just swim around it" when someone takes a dump in the community swimming pool. Saying "it's freedom of speech" is like saying "Take a bite! It's good for you!".
  • Kattegat_Twin
    505 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Mean man use words that I don't like. Must stop him from talking. I'm offended. My feelings matter. You can't hurt my feelings. Ban him. Orange man bad.

    This is a disgusting example of a "human being" folks.
  • CS-2107
    1503 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Indeed there could be a problem with the filter, as people find a way to "write" around those. So if you ban offensive terms like "German Potato" or whatever, people will find other ways to express the same thing, like "Sauerkrautfresser", so you have to ban a great number of words, in order to achive the goal of really no way to offend anyone. At this point the chat could be removed.

    Or what, as this is a ww1 game I write "Yeah flee you german dogs" in the chat for fun, as we just defeated the german empire ingame. Will that get me banned? Or "Forward Goddamnit"? Will that get me banned?

    You can ban certain words, like the offensive term for african people. That would be good to filter. But banning for example the word "black" would remove the ability to tell my team that in the black house there is an enemy.

    I think for now we all just have to "accept" that some people aren't the brightest bulbs in the candellier and still think that it would be the right thing to do to judge ppl by their race, religion, ethnicity etc....
  • Forkbeard84
    1490 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    And who is going to decide what is racist and what needs to be censored? Therein lies the problem because as soon as you give one group the power to decide what should be censored, you open the door to having your own freedoms taken away. That's why "Freedom of Speech is the right to express opinions without censorship or restraint." Give me the unfiltered speech and I'll listen to what I want to. And at the same time, I'll say what I want to and you don't have to listen. That's freedom of speech.

    Many of the people asking for censorship these days should be careful of what they wish for. They are opening the door to oppression.

    Well the thing of it is (i'm saying this sincerely), is that, there never has been Freedom of Speech when it comes to business. We in the states still have the FCC as an example, with monitors who determine what can be broadcasted on tv and radio (providing its not satellite or cable). It's been like that for literally many decades.

    Freedom of Speech, is what Government provides, in that you can't be arrested by them for it. Not that you can't be thrown out of an establishment (that happens every day with protesters or customers not following decorum) or out of a job, or forum, or game, or otherwise civilly liable for that speech, if its determined to slander or hurt others.

    Personally, i never heard these Freedom of Speech arguments of this type on games and the like, or the expectancy of, until you go to social media thinking folks have these "Rights".

    And what folks don't understand, is there are Moderators who make the determinations on Games, Forums, or Facebook, or You Tube and the like. They have TOS folks have to follow, and have folks who monitor and make those determinations.

    So, it's not a slippery slope at all when you're dealing with private entities.

    You have to simply treat it as, you're on someone elses property (like, their servers), and in that proprietors of that property that determine what proper conduct is. Of course, there's no forcing anybody to play certain games, or any games. Or work at certain establishments with rules you may not like.

    You make a really good point about private entities being able to do what they want and filter any speech they want. Very true and they don't fall under freedom of speech laws. I still think it can lead to oppression though. Imagine a private company like Facebook deciding to filter something out that THEY decided was wrong. That's going to impact the speech of a lot of people. Or imagine Google deciding not to provide certain search results because THEY decide it is bad. That's going to impact a lot of people and could lead to oppression. I'd still rather be given all the raw speech and information and then filter it myself.
    There is perhaps no worse abuse of Freedom of Speech than to use it to excuse bigotry and hatred. There is no 'right' to abuse others.

    *All* freedoms come with exclusions and limitations. Most people can self-regulate because they feel responsibility to their society, have empathy for others and know when they are being 'bad'. Even a sociopath can see what society deems acceptable and moderate their behaviour if they aren't stupid.

    Some apparently just can't work it out and need to be told when to shut the heck up for the good of us all.

    Saying "ignore it" when it comes to things like racism is like saying "Just swim around it" when someone takes a dump in the community swimming pool. Saying "it's freedom of speech" is like saying "Take a bite! It's good for you!".

    Racism is bad and disgusting. I believe the definition of racism is prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior. I also do not agree with using freedom of speech to excuse bigotry and hatred. However I do believe for reasons previously stated that people be free to speak like a bigot and then society can tell them why it's wrong. I don't think their speech should be filtered. I don't like what they say but I respect their right to say it. The problem is in deciding what to filter. And what is the definition of racism exactly? I have several people I know on facebook telling me that only white people can be racist because white people are a privileged class and have always been the class of oppression. They use terms like "white fragility" to describe white people that don't understand that only whites can be racist. They say no other race can be racist because all other races have been oppressed by whites. Are those people going to run the racism filter? I would not agree with their filter. That's the slippery slope I'm relating too.






  • ronybaloney
    232 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    I don't know.....
    I'm absolutely all for free speech, but when I hear impassioned oratories about free speech when it comes to rationalizing racism, it just feels a like a bridge a little too far..... and, kind of a "thou dost protest too much" feeling for me.
  • xBCxSEALxTEAMx6
    1303 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    And who is going to decide what is racist and what needs to be censored? Therein lies the problem because as soon as you give one group the power to decide what should be censored, you open the door to having your own freedoms taken away. That's why "Freedom of Speech is the right to express opinions without censorship or restraint." Give me the unfiltered speech and I'll listen to what I want to. And at the same time, I'll say what I want to and you don't have to listen. That's freedom of speech.

    Many of the people asking for censorship these days should be careful of what they wish for. They are opening the door to oppression.

    Well the thing of it is (i'm saying this sincerely), is that, there never has been Freedom of Speech when it comes to business. We in the states still have the FCC as an example, with monitors who determine what can be broadcasted on tv and radio (providing its not satellite or cable). It's been like that for literally many decades.

    Freedom of Speech, is what Government provides, in that you can't be arrested by them for it. Not that you can't be thrown out of an establishment (that happens every day with protesters or customers not following decorum) or out of a job, or forum, or game, or otherwise civilly liable for that speech, if its determined to slander or hurt others.

    Personally, i never heard these Freedom of Speech arguments of this type on games and the like, or the expectancy of, until you go to social media thinking folks have these "Rights".

    And what folks don't understand, is there are Moderators who make the determinations on Games, Forums, or Facebook, or You Tube and the like. They have TOS folks have to follow, and have folks who monitor and make those determinations.

    So, it's not a slippery slope at all when you're dealing with private entities.

    You have to simply treat it as, you're on someone elses property (like, their servers), and in that proprietors of that property that determine what proper conduct is. Of course, there's no forcing anybody to play certain games, or any games. Or work at certain establishments with rules you may not like.

    You make a really good point about private entities being able to do what they want and filter any speech they want. Very true and they don't fall under freedom of speech laws. I still think it can lead to oppression though. Imagine a private company like Facebook deciding to filter something out that THEY decided was wrong. That's going to impact the speech of a lot of people. Or imagine Google deciding not to provide certain search results because THEY decide it is bad. That's going to impact a lot of people and could lead to oppression. I'd still rather be given all the raw speech and information and then filter it myself.
    There is perhaps no worse abuse of Freedom of Speech than to use it to excuse bigotry and hatred. There is no 'right' to abuse others.

    *All* freedoms come with exclusions and limitations. Most people can self-regulate because they feel responsibility to their society, have empathy for others and know when they are being 'bad'. Even a sociopath can see what society deems acceptable and moderate their behaviour if they aren't stupid.

    Some apparently just can't work it out and need to be told when to shut the heck up for the good of us all.

    Saying "ignore it" when it comes to things like racism is like saying "Just swim around it" when someone takes a dump in the community swimming pool. Saying "it's freedom of speech" is like saying "Take a bite! It's good for you!".

    Racism is bad and disgusting. I believe the definition of racism is prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior. I also do not agree with using freedom of speech to excuse bigotry and hatred. However I do believe for reasons previously stated that people be free to speak like a bigot and then society can tell them why it's wrong. I don't think their speech should be filtered. I don't like what they say but I respect their right to say it. The problem is in deciding what to filter. And what is the definition of racism exactly? I have several people I know on facebook telling me that only white people can be racist because white people are a privileged class and have always been the class of oppression. They use terms like "white fragility" to describe white people that don't understand that only whites can be racist. They say no other race can be racist because all other races have been oppressed by whites. Are those people going to run the racism filter? I would not agree with their filter. That's the slippery slope I'm relating too.






    Right, but there's an easy answer to prevent these misunderstandings by mods or filters, which is, just don't post on Facebook or social media lol. Some folks may find this funny, or even impossible, but there are those of us who did not grow up with internet, or social media. If we wanted to excercise our Freedom Speech, it was go to the public square, voting booth or town hall.

    Even today, i don't have a Facebook or Twitter, or You Tube etc, acct. I never did, and never will lol. I started on the gaming forums, when years ago i bought a game, called Xbox, and they told me i had to post the question on the forums. But absent that, i don''t use social media.

    I think the slippery slope, comes when those who are born into social media, seem to think these private companies are their public square, when it''s simply not. These are private companies, driven by profits and civil liabilities, and factually are not at all our public square.

    So yes, there is an issue of what can be construed as what, and by whom . But that's only for those who believe private companies are an outlet for Freedom of Speech, where it is clearly not.
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