Semi-Autos need big recoil increase

Comments

  • ChiefSniper
    69 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    If anything needs more recoil it's SMG's and LMG's.
  • Cpt_Blitz_26
    243 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited February 11
    If anything needs more recoil it's SMG's and LMG's.

    Nah man SMGs kick like the dickins if you don't get the right specializations, and MGs need to be bipodded on cover or prone to even be used effectively.

    Semi auto point and pewpew at range outclasses these by far.
  • Cpt_Blitz_26
    243 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Buff recon, remove 3x scopes from assault and support.

    This is my whole point... thank you!

    Just remove 3x scopes from all classes BUT Recon.

    Most balancing issues are solved with this one simple change.
  • bran1986
    5005 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    If anything needs more recoil it's SMG's and LMG's.

    Lol
  • Kunstula
    389 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    edited February 11
    Not just a recoil increase, also a muzzle velocity decrease. Semi-auto rifles in BF5 have higher muzzle velocity than scout rifles and so do LMG's, which is also a much overlooked big contributing factor why those weapons are easier to land hits with than scout rifles at long range. It's absolutely nuts that scout weapons do not have the highest muzzle velocity of all weapon classes when they are supposed to be specifically designed for being the easiest weapon to land hits with at long range.
  • Major_Pungspark
    1348 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Remove 3x sights from all but recon, remove glint totally from 3x scope. Sure they can remove them from all sights, it is not like the number of snipers on some maps will change anyway.
  • ChiefSniper
    69 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited February 11
    If anything needs more recoil it's SMG's and LMG's.
    Nah man SMGs kick like the dickins if you don't get the right specializations, and MGs need to be bipodded on cover or prone to even be used effectively.
    Semi auto point and pewpew at range outclasses these by far.
    A fair point. I guess I'm just being biased as I've tended to gravitate more toward Semi Auto's. I do agree though that the Scout rifles need a higher muzzle velocity (as default, sans specializations) than the Semi Auto's.

  • Major_Pungspark
    1348 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Kunstula wrote: »
    Not just a recoil increase, also a muzzle velocity decrease. Semi-auto rifles in BF5 have higher muzzle velocity than scout rifles and so do LMG's, which is also a much overlooked big contributing factor why those weapons are easier to land hits with than scout rifles at long range. It's absolutely nuts that scout weapons do not have the highest muzzle velocity of all weapon classes when they are supposed to be specifically designed for being the easiest weapon to land hits with at long range.

    Prpbably is a game balancing thing that we don´t have hitscan sniper weapons, that some would prefer. Probably is a better idea to nerf bullet velocity of other weapons.
  • TuxedoBanana279
    326 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    ghos7bear wrote: »
    They're stupid accurate and have almost no recoil. They outshoot machine guns and sniper rifles. They even outshoot assault rifles unless point blank. Why the hell full rifle caliber on such big rifles gives you no recoil what so ever? This is unrealistic, this is unbalanced, this is [removed]

    Yes, they definitely need to be tweaked. I should not lose fire fights at point blank range with an smg or assault rifle against a semi auto rifle.
  • VVaxDaddy
    80 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    drbobcat wrote: »
    To reiterate, though, I don't want them touching random bullet deviation whatsoever. In my opinion, there shouldn't be any RBD at all (aside from hipfire). Randomness inherently goes against the spirit of competition and that's something I'll never endorse, full stop. Increase recoil. Increase bullet drop. Decrease velocity. Even remove/modify optics. No RBD.

    RBD around here has pretty much become a bs buzzword to imply something is unskilled as opposed to actually understanding and getting to the point of why the mechanic exists and how it should be executed.

    He's talking about spread increase per shot which is not truly "random" bullet deviation because it's a direct response to the fire rate you're using, therefore
    its not random. If you have a gripe with base spread I guess I somewhat understand, but I think it's ridiculous to consider spread increase per shot as uncompetitive just because the bullet placement has a more random nature resulting from spread. You can control the spread by firerate making it not random, that's the point of the mechanic. If anything it adds a skill gap when executed properly.
  • bloodprizm
    86 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Removing 3x scopes from all weapons except recon would be the dumbest thing ever.
  • StealthAria
    88 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    If anything needs more recoil it's SMG's and LMG's.
    Nah man SMGs kick like the dickins if you don't get the right specializations, and MGs need to be bipodded on cover or prone to even be used effectively.
    Semi auto point and pewpew at range outclasses these by far.
    A fair point. I guess I'm just being biased as I've tended to gravitate more toward Semi Auto's. I do agree though that the Scout rifles need a higher muzzle velocity (as default, sans specializations) than the Semi Auto's.

    You tend towards the SA's, but fail to recognise their lack of recoil? It's painfully easy to mag dump and score nothing but headshots. I'll have to dig through my game clips for it but I should have a clip of me dumping entire magazines into the heads of targets at the practice range from over 100 meters. (Might've deleted it though, hard drive was getting full so I got rid of a bunch of them) All the SA's only take 2 headshots to secure a kill, all of them. If I can spam bullets out like that on console and only get headshots, how easy is it for PC players and their easy-mode recoil control?
  • drbobcat
    14 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited February 12
    drbobcat wrote: »
    I disagree with any and all changes to spread. DICE was trying to get away from random bullet deviation with BFV and has mostly succeeded. However, I do agree that SARs are too powerful at the moment (and/or recon SLRs are far too weak).

    I think their rate of fire and lack of drop are the biggest issues. It doesn't make any sense that the assault class can so consistently outclass recons at their ideal ranges. DICE makes recon weapons suffer from exaggerated bullet drop and drag, so I do not see why assault players shouldn't suffer from the same issues if they're competing at similar ranges. Not rocket science.

    To reiterate, though, I don't want them touching random bullet deviation whatsoever. In my opinion, there shouldn't be any RBD at all (aside from hipfire). Randomness inherently goes against the spirit of competition and that's something I'll never endorse, full stop. Increase recoil. Increase bullet drop. Decrease velocity. Even remove/modify optics. No RBD.

    All you had to do was pace your shots in BF1 and the spread would be more or less the same as it is in BFV. This whole random bullet deviation crap is such a manufactured problem. Spread increase per shot balanced the semi autos far better than recoil or drop off ever will and added another thing you had to manage, thus increasing the skill required to use a gun optimally, not decreasing it.

    I disagree. Outside of using macros, someone's ability to fire quickly (in the case of semi-automatic weapons) while still managing recoil is both difficult to do optimally and consistently. RBD is literally random and thus means that two people could take the same shot from the same distance at one could fail to hit all due to a bad die roll. I believe the only real reason why it was introduced was due to the rise of FPS games on console. There, it is impractical to ask your players to regularly deal with weapons that kick up at excessive angles unless you want to either (a) destroy the balance of automatic vs semi-automatic weapons and/or (b) make your aim assist way too strong. This isn't a slam against console gamers (I play on them about a third of the time), but merely a recognition of a trend. You don't see Rising Storm, Post Scriptum, Squad, or ArmA on console because (among many other things), the recoil in those games is quite high. They don't have RBD and they're in no way considered "easy" or "casual" games.

    I understand what you're getting at, and I will concede that there is a measure of skill needed to manage RBD in shooters (and I recognize that there is already a degree of randomness to recoil as well). Yet, there's only so much you can do and it is infuriating when you did everything right with your fine aim and recoil management, only to roll poorly and lose an otherwise well-executed engagement. The BF franchise itself has already gone through this song and dance before. RBD in BF3 was significantly less than BF1 and most who've played the former would argue that it has better gunplay and that it generally feels better to play. Often, RBD is cited as one of the main culprits as to why. And with BFV, it was listed as a key selling point to those who were disappointed with the previous game's gameplay. And speaking personally, I'd be really bummed out if they caved on that. From what I've read on social media, the forums, reddit, and youtube, most would agree.
    Guys there is a much simpler solution to all of this... don't need to make huge/time consuming changes....

    Simply remove the 3x scope on all kits except recon class.

    This makes the necessary buffs and nerfs directly and indirectly across the board. Think about it.

    I think iron sights should be more encouraged in this game anyways. 3x scopes are a HUGE advantage and are overused.

    That'd be okay, too, though another option I'd prefer would be to move semi-auto rifles to the recon class. It makes no sense to me that assault SARs are so, so, so much better than their recon SLR brethren (as mentioned above). Recon is THE long range class. They should own it unconditionally. And besides, assault still could switch their assault rifles to semi-automatic fire mode if they were really struggling. If DICE isn't willing to go that far, simply give them scope glint (and maybe all 3x optics). If recon SLRs must suffer from scope glint while having no TTK benefit to compensate, -all- weapons with scopes should suffer from glint.
  • MachoFantast1c0
    1791 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    drbobcat wrote: »
    I disagree with any and all changes to spread. DICE was trying to get away from random bullet deviation with BFV and has mostly succeeded. However, I do agree that SARs are too powerful at the moment (and/or recon SLRs are far too weak).

    I think their rate of fire and lack of drop are the biggest issues. It doesn't make any sense that the assault class can so consistently outclass recons at their ideal ranges. DICE makes recon weapons suffer from exaggerated bullet drop and drag, so I do not see why assault players shouldn't suffer from the same issues if they're competing at similar ranges. Not rocket science.

    To reiterate, though, I don't want them touching random bullet deviation whatsoever. In my opinion, there shouldn't be any RBD at all (aside from hipfire). Randomness inherently goes against the spirit of competition and that's something I'll never endorse, full stop. Increase recoil. Increase bullet drop. Decrease velocity. Even remove/modify optics. No RBD.

    All you had to do was pace your shots in BF1 and the spread would be more or less the same as it is in BFV. This whole random bullet deviation crap is such a manufactured problem. Spread increase per shot balanced the semi autos far better than recoil or drop off ever will and added another thing you had to manage, thus increasing the skill required to use a gun optimally, not decreasing it.

    The only weapons that suffered from spread were slug shotguns and the Obrez when using deliberate, paced shots in ADS. The base spread was just a bit too much.
  • Jedi76
    828 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited February 12
    bloodprizm wrote: »
    Removing 3x scopes from all weapons except recon would be the dumbest thing ever.

    I agree.

    I also think adding scope glint to all 3x is ridiculous, just remove it from the Recon one, far better idea.

    I try to play Assault in a "marksman-sharpshooter" style and love having a 3x. It helps me defend and attack objectives but not get rinsed by the enemy every two seconds because I am a bit older and my reflexes are not as fast any more

    I don't want added recoil to the Gewehr 43, which is what I usually use, the trade off with this gun is that unless I get a headshot, I have to tap my enemy three or four times to get the kill. After the first or second shot people usually either drop or run behind something, you have to be quick to get the kill most of the time. Why should I not get the kill just because my gun has been nerfed to recoil more? Why should someone I got the drop on turn around and kill me because I am waiting longer for my gun to settle in between shots?

    Just give the Gewehr 43 and the like a bit of a nerf to their range, perhaps effectiveness drops sharply after say 100m. Either this or give these rifles to the Recons and remove 3x glint.

    That said. If I can drop a sniper with my Gewehr 43 at 250/ 300m, which is almost always 3 shots because you rarely get a headshot at that distance. If I can get 3 to 4 shots into him before he realises what is going on, then maybe that guy should not be sniping.
  • TheyHaveScissors
    440 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Many weapons, also outside the semi-auto rifles need a recoil increase. In fact, I think BF5 needs a major overhaul in it's gun behavior department. DICE made CoD of BF5.
  • Piotrek1983pm
    337 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    I have already nearly 11000 killes with SMLE TURNER and have to say I love it, is it overpowered? No! I could jump into Lewis gun or Stg44 and do slightly better as I play those too, I have not noticed as well to be killed by DRMs often. Plus, did you try to play dmr's yourselves?
  • GrizzGolf
    739 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    If anything needs more recoil it's SMG's and LMG's.

    Nah man SMGs kick like the dickins if you don't get the right specializations, and MGs need to be bipodded on cover or prone to even be used effectively.

    Semi auto point and pewpew at range outclasses these by far.

    Hes right about the SMGs. If you don't have them set right then good luck
  • DrunkOnRedWine
    564 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    edited February 12
    Deleted
  • ackers75
    1802 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    M_Rat13 wrote: »
    Why not just buff Recon guns instead? If your problem is them losing to Assualt at long range.

    Recon gun buffing eh?
    No just no that’s ridiculous
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