Can we finally admit attrition was a terrible addition to battlefield?

Comments

  • von_Campenstein
    6553 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    edited March 18
    Pelliy wrote: »
    It made more players passive, the game is not fun. You heal up and a random explosion or a random spray bullet tagged you, taking away your heal.

    This would make sense in a 5v5 game. Attrition in a chaotic game is absurd. I really hope it does not return in the series.

    Same with ammo attrition. I was convinced that this was okay. It's not. It's bad too. You can keep the grenade timers the same but also needs to get rid of that Attrition also.

    Faster TTK in BF1 made people more passive, you cannot attribute that to attrition alone in BF5 when experience that fresh already showed what cranked TTK would do to gameplay. Fast TTK and attrition combined maybe not the best combo, each on their own would probably work much better. The disconnect among the devs with how they see the game being played and how players are incentivised to play it is concerning, cutting in the hyperinflation of scopes would be a good first step to get people moving around more. Maybe the silent majority is fine with more static gameplay?
  • Billydoc1
    519 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited March 19
    Luke88gw wrote: »
    how attrition was in alpha/beta?

    worse
    attrition was a mistake IMHO
  • Choongangchong
    67 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    if not attrition we would have bf1 all over again with most people playing either assault or sniper.
    Now people actually pick up medic and support because they have some limited use.
    Altho with all the ammo/medic crates every where its hardly any problem anyways unless you are one of those hill campers that never enters an objective area. Even then you can just use supply drop to yourself since getting the necessary squad points isnt hard at all.
    Personally I notice no difference in my playstyle compared to BF3-BF1 since I'm always in or near an objective area.
  • disposalist
    8337 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    if not attrition we would have bf1 all over again with most people playing either assault or sniper.
    Now people actually pick up medic and support because they have some limited use.
    What? In BF1 a LOT of people play medic and support. I would say the classes get pretty even use (unless all you play is inf only).
    It's BF5 that is all assault. Support is fine, yes, but medic?! Medic is awful in BF5.

    I'm glad for you that you find it compatible with your playstyle, but BF5's attrition compounds the lack of class balance and it's nothing like BF1.
  • Jarp75
    67 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    I like the attrition system because it slows down the gameplay a bit and forces players to think about where to shoot not only spray around.
  • xKusagamix
    875 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    if not attrition we would have bf1 all over again with most people playing either assault or sniper.
    Now people actually pick up medic and support because they have some limited use.
    What? In BF1 a LOT of people play medic and support. I would say the classes get pretty even use (unless all you play is inf only).
    It's BF5 that is all assault. Support is fine, yes, but medic?! Medic is awful in BF5.

    I'm glad for you that you find it compatible with your playstyle, but BF5's attrition compounds the lack of class balance and it's nothing like BF1.
    Medic lack weapon variants but i don't think Medic class as a whole is awful, i get pretty decent score with Medic class, even with map like Hamada, always run with 5 smokes. No class is more awful than Recon right now.

    Poor damage BARs at mid to close range, slow ROF SLRs, not even has highest bullet velocity and a big flash light at the head.
  • alienstout
    680 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Meh, adapt to the crates and pick up ammo from dead people. It's not bad, just a little different.
  • disposalist
    8337 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    alienstout wrote: »
    Meh, adapt to the crates and pick up ammo from dead people. It's not bad, just a little different.
    For those who are always on the objectives and killing people point-blank (assault?) that's fine. For anyone trying to be tactical (no, not camping, just not running around like a headless chicken) you can easily run out of ammo/health.

    Sure, you can adapt. But is it fun or frustrating? Is it a tactical improvement or not?
  • alienstout
    680 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    So running around the perimeter being sneaky, or being a REMF, or hiding behind your team? For all of them you have to opportunity to go and be sneaky and get ammo. Either that or bribe a support player to be in you squad.
  • duellingcarl
    159 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited March 19
    This is the biggest reason why my $80 copy of BFV is still collecting dust. Attrition got negative feedback in the alphas and they kept it for the beta. Attrition got negative feedback in the betas and they said we will fix it. They didn't fix it for full release so I decided not to play multiplayer until it's fixed. But, no one else I know bought the game so I'd have no one to play with anyway. I've preordered Andy played every single BF title. BF1 was and still is way more fun to play. They wanted to be too Battle Royale with BFV and it bit them and I think they know it now. I expect the ext BF title to be amazing like 1 and 3.
  • DingoKillr
    3429 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    edited March 19
    I personally like the attrition but do feel you should start with full ammo (tanks need more ammo too) and the health packs should not both heal and become a spare (should require 2 med packs). However combined with the faster ttk, i feel the attrition system is kind of redundant. As an average player there are not many times in a round (if any) i will find myself with zero primary ammo ( though happens more frequently if using an SLR) or low health and no spare med pack. You tend to be either dead or 100% health the majority of the game. I dont think the game requires an extra BTK, it's just that all weapons are too darn accurate. By the time the game registers you have been hit by the first shot, a few ms later rounds 2/3/4 (from easily spammable weapons like semi autos) hit you and you are dead.
    That is the whole issue.
    Attrition meant to keep players below 100 in health and keep ammo low, so players can't go solo superman.

    That not what we have. Let's give every player bandage and give Assault the highest regen amount, then let's give Assault the most ammo pickup, the lowest BTK and more ammo.

    So we end up with classes design to be whacked by attrition while Assault is not, even tanks got hit much harder than planes.
    - Support being screwed with LMG at long range, MMG at short and until recently shotgun up close. Here is why LMG need bipod at long range but the accuracy at that range is not right for the number of bullets, MMG with so much standing spread with no ADS unless bipod, on top a cool down not so good for a defense weapon and shotgun had a 2 to 3 hit even at 10m. As for gadget 2 defensive, 1 offensive and ammo(fairly balanced).
    - Medic at short and beyond. SMG have single fire mode to extended range but com'on the BTK/TTK at that range is a joke. Smoke or mine, I don't run smoke unless I am either running Suomi or tommy what is point of trying to get close to enemy when every Assault's weapon and most MG can easily out gun in short range. Leaving it as Recon Hunter. Bandage or crate needs better balance reason to take crate.
    - Recon the most screwed over with minimum damage design for alpha attrition, slow fire(ROF/Velocity), glint, low ammo pick, encouraged to be off an objective. Gadgets with low ammo counts and meant to be used at short range, what is the point of a decoy shooting a flare straight up. We can have to many flares over a target come off it, that why we need a small radius so a yapper said on his channel while running Assault with 3 Launchers and 3 dynamite, glad DICE did not listen that time.
    - Tanks are slow and relative low ammo, the reason I say relative is the amount of repair station on a map and how long it takes getting there and resupply time this has a bit to much impact on most modes and maps.
    - Planes it almost no impact to being to good with a station at each end. With the repair and resupply means every time a plane is heading into battle they would be 100% while their counters are looking for damaged planes.
    - Assault the most abused class it must be tough being able to 1HK planes, 2 HK Tanks, all range primary weapons with dynamite spare. They have everything fast TTK, low BTK (2 HS), low recoil/spread, high velocity, high regen, high ammo pick up, the most explosives and yet we have people calling for nerfs to anything but Assault.

    Upping BTK on every weapon was never going to fix. Adjusting some weapons BTK well increase some TTK evening out some issues, recoil and spread changes will also be needed increasing some practical TTK for other weapons, that leaves a few more that need other types of adjustments to be improved.

    Adjusting/scrapping attrition is not going fix the imbalance either. Planes it would have almost no impact. Tanks can camp at distances easier while up close support fails. What would it change for infantry more chance a players is at 100% and few more bullets/gadgets for some.

    Poor decision based on feedback from more valued players lead us to this, honestly I don't see it changing anytime soon.
  • bran1986
    5487 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Luke88gw wrote: »
    how attrition was in alpha/beta?

    No bandages on spawn
    Health stations would only heal 50 points of health, needed a medic to get to 100
    Buddy revives were longer, as were medic revives
    Buddy revives healed only to 35 health
    If your squad wiped you wouldn't be able to be revived if you were down.
    One less magazine on spawn
    Less ammo picked up off dead bodies.
  • Sixclicks
    5073 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited March 19
    bran1986 wrote: »
    Luke88gw wrote: »
    how attrition was in alpha/beta?

    No bandages on spawn
    Health stations would only heal 50 points of health, needed a medic to get to 100
    Buddy revives were longer, as were medic revives
    Buddy revives healed only to 35 health
    If your squad wiped you wouldn't be able to be revived if you were down.
    One less magazine on spawn
    Less ammo picked up off dead bodies.

    You could auto heal 50 health though. And it was pretty fast to start the auto heal. I had a enemy player gain that much back in 7 seconds after my last hit. This was before bandages were added.

    Now you can auto heal 30 (40 as assault) and it takes a while to start.
  • SirTerrible
    1584 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    bran1986 wrote: »
    Luke88gw wrote: »
    how attrition was in alpha/beta?

    No bandages on spawn
    Health stations would only heal 50 points of health, needed a medic to get to 100
    Buddy revives were longer, as were medic revives
    Buddy revives healed only to 35 health
    If your squad wiped you wouldn't be able to be revived if you were down.
    One less magazine on spawn
    Less ammo picked up off dead bodies.

    I would not have even bought the game if it came like that at launch. Whoever designed that has clearly never had fun in a game before in their life.
  • HardAimedKid
    11385 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Can’t we all just agree that bfv is pretty bland in all aspects? Here’s to hoping firestorm is a success 🥳
  • disposalist
    8337 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Can’t we all just agree that bfv is pretty bland in all aspects? Here’s to hoping firestorm is a success 🥳
    Yes. Not really. ;)
  • GrumbleSG9
    249 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    I'm quite liking the attrition system overall. When I first played BFV I wasn't so keen but it's really grown on me.

    My only gripes ...

    It would be nice if we spawned in with a full load-out and I think the ammo/medic crates need some tweaking to make them an appealing choice to equip.
  • bran1986
    5487 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Sixclicks wrote: »
    bran1986 wrote: »
    Luke88gw wrote: »
    how attrition was in alpha/beta?

    No bandages on spawn
    Health stations would only heal 50 points of health, needed a medic to get to 100
    Buddy revives were longer, as were medic revives
    Buddy revives healed only to 35 health
    If your squad wiped you wouldn't be able to be revived if you were down.
    One less magazine on spawn
    Less ammo picked up off dead bodies.

    You could auto heal 50 health though. And it was pretty fast to start the auto heal. I had a enemy player gain that much back in 7 seconds after my last hit. This was before bandages were added.

    Now you can auto heal 30 (40 as assault) and it takes a while to start.

    Yeah I forgot about the 50 regen. Yeah it was also really quick.
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