This Week in Battlefield V

Planes ruin the game

Comments

  • SirSpectacle
    788 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    ElliotLH said:
    Public Service Announcement: BF 1 has dedicated maps and servers for DOGFIGHTING ONLY.
    Please go there as soon as possible.
    Haven't those been dead since a little while after Apocalypse launched?
    Probably.. I wouldn't know since I don't fly. But I believe BF 1 has RSP... I think the pilot-horses should pool their lunch money and go there immediately.
    Do you really think Fjell would play better if all the people who like dogfighting go play BF1, leaving all the planes available for bomber pilots in BFV? 
  • Hawxxeye
    5557 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    edited June 21
    WesleyF09 said:
    "Planes" is different from "bombers"
    You mean "fighters"
    In BF history at least since BF3 the fighters have been owning the skies and avoiding retribution by the ground.

    ElliotLH said:
    Public Service Announcement: BF 1 has dedicated maps and servers for DOGFIGHTING ONLY.
    Please go there as soon as possible.
    Haven't those been dead since a little while after Apocalypse launched?
    Probably.. I wouldn't know since I don't fly. But I believe BF 1 has RSP... I think the pilot-horses should pool their lunch money and go there immediately.
    Do you really think Fjell would play better if all the people who like dogfighting go play BF1, leaving all the planes available for bomber pilots in BFV? 
    Actually I do. Superfighter pilots had been pests in every BF game I have played (that has planes). Most of the time they are not even really dogfighting, they are bullying the rest out of the skies and there is little that can be done to them from the ground.
    In a way it is even worse in BFV due to one faction having hands down the ultimate fighter.
    There was a time where I spent  a considerable effort to get decent into dogfighting in BFV but I ended up finding out that unless there is a huge skill difference, the dogfight still goes to the one who starts at the other's tail most of the time. To keep persisting into being a dogfight specialist in BFV you need to be one of the people who are fueled by the rage of other pilots with little interest on what is going on on the ground unless it is an AA (imho)
  • Hindenburg1911
    17 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    wwe need bigger maps without  restrictet area!
  • RichardSinerface
    78 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Anytime that AA becomes able to shoot down planes all the pilots complain and DICE nerfs. I wish there were more plane free maps. Hopefully that is an option with rental servers
  • Hawxxeye
    5557 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Anytime that AA becomes able to shoot down planes all the pilots complain and DICE nerfs. I wish there were more plane free maps. Hopefully that is an option with rental servers
    because they go from one extreme to another.
    It never occurred to them that they could maybe increase number the possible AA guns on the map either by default or by supports building them. This way it would be more likely that a super pest pilot will get owned by multiple people using AAs.
  • warslag
    1452 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    edited June 22
    Planes are Battlefield. The only difference now is that players have gradually made Battlefield more realistic which now means that when you die you stay dead a lot of the time. If they got zapped into life again it wouldn't bother them so much. That was the beauty of Battlefield but they couldn't resist tinkering with it. Anything that kills you now becomes very annoying - it's always like that in games where you stay dead.
    Post edited by warslag on
  • VincentNZ
    2892 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    They always tend to ruin the game, since they can not be balanced sufficiently in combination with ground armour and infantry. Which means most of the time, that they interact with me, but I can not interact with them.
    Stationary AA can not be good, since otherwise everybody would man them, so it is crap and nobody uses them. On the other hand they are easy to avoid anyway thanks to generous map restrictions, sight and physical cover and poor stationary placement. So planes only have MAAs and other planes to worry about.
    MAA is always outnumbered and under threat from infantry, other armour as well as planes. The free vehicle choice makes that effect even worse, because it creates situations where there is no AA present at all, when one is needed. The notion that any player can make an educated decision on what is needed is ridiculous. It also makes "flavour of the month" spawns the most dominant, meaning if there is something uncounterable then it will get chosen.
    Additionally you have the mobility advantage and no physical barriers, so nothing can escape hot situations like a plane, even if there is a counter present. The more skilled you are the less you have to worry about anything, too. As opposed to ground play where death can come from anywhere anytime, even when in a tank. Also the flight mechanics are casualized in many ways, with 3rd person, freelook an intuitive bombing sight and a huge payload. If infantry had somehting similarily convenient it would be blamed for everything, however we allow such things on planes. Also for a tank to work at 100% efficiency you always need more than one guy. Planes always work well with only one pilot, while in BFV having only one is favourable.
    The only BF game where it was somewhat working was BF4, as the MAA could deal with jets (as an area denial tool), and was actually present on many maps. The plane spawns were few and their anti-infantry capabilities were limited, while their AT capabilities were good. Additionally there were the choppers as hybrid that even infantry could reliably engage. Before that jets ruled the sky, and afterwards they did so too.
    .
    One big issue is the truce that we often have in the sky. When it is so much easier and so more rewarding to just farm people on the ground that have no counter, why would any plane engage in dogfighting? It is counterproductive and we saw it a lot in BF1 as well as in BFV.
  • Hawxxeye
    5557 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    VincentNZ said:
    One big issue is the truce that we often have in the sky. When it is so much easier and so more rewarding to just farm people on the ground that have no counter, why would any plane engage in dogfighting? It is counterproductive and we saw it a lot in BF1 as well as in BFV.
    Because dogfights are unfun and do little to help the people bellow. It is less likely that you will clear the enemy tanks if you also have to worry about the grudge you have accumulated by the enemy pilots

  • Raspu71nG
    118 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    I think MAA ruins the game, they just camp inside their base the whole match on conquest mode, and IMO they are the lowest skilled players in the match that is why they use MAA. they are not good as a tanker or pilots.



  • StormSaxon
    658 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    MAA is weak. They stay in their spawn as 1 hit from a plane. Dead. 2 hits from AT rockets. Dead/Immobilized. AND planes are always flying around and over their spawn.

    Need a serious armour buff. Stuka should need 2-3 hits minimum to destroy one.
    OR make it so all ordnance fired into AND out of spawn zones has no effect. Voila planes stop b-lining it for the enemy spawn, MAA will leave.
  • okiie_918
    130 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Hawxxeye wrote: »
    WesleyF09 said:
    "Planes" is different from "bombers"



    You mean "fighters"
    In BF history at least since BF3 the fighters have been owning the skies and avoiding retribution by the ground.


    SirSpectacle said:

    Astr0damus said:

    ElliotLH said:

    Astr0damus said:
    Public Service Announcement: BF 1 has dedicated maps and servers for DOGFIGHTING ONLY.
    Please go there as soon as possible.

    Haven't those been dead since a little while after Apocalypse launched?

    Probably.. I wouldn't know since I don't fly. But I believe BF 1 has RSP... I think the pilot-horses should pool their lunch money and go there immediately.


    Do you really think Fjell would play better if all the people who like dogfighting go play BF1, leaving all the planes available for bomber pilots in BFV? 

    Actually I do. Superfighter pilots had been pests in every BF game I have played (that has planes). Most of the time they are not even really dogfighting, they are bullying the rest out of the skies and there is little that can be done to them from the ground.
    In a way it is even worse in BFV due to one faction having hands down the ultimate fighter.
    There was a time where I spent  a considerable effort to get decent into dogfighting in BFV but I ended up finding out that unless there is a huge skill difference, the dogfight still goes to the one who starts at the other's tail most of the time. To keep persisting into being a dogfight specialist in BFV you need to be one of the people who are fueled by the rage of other pilots with little interest on what is going on on the ground unless it is an AA (imho)

    I am really confused on the which faction has the ultimate fighter? That's a preference thing IMHO! You're gonna say spitfire VA and I am going to say G-2 109. Also dog fighting absolutely exist and when you get two pilots who are both top notch it's really fun and intense! Problem is most of the time the gap in skill is huge by both sides.

    Bombers stand no chance against a below average fighter pilot it's really easy to kill a bomber. Especially if any flak shooting it at all. I've been shot down by some pro AA tankers and they simply don't miss! Planes make battlefield what it is and isn't! No planes I wouldn't even have bought the game lol.
  • okiie_918
    130 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Hawxxeye wrote: »
    VincentNZ said:
    One big issue is the truce that we often have in the sky. When it is so much easier and so more rewarding to just farm people on the ground that have no counter, why would any plane engage in dogfighting? It is counterproductive and we saw it a lot in BF1 as well as in BFV.


    Because dogfights are unfun and do little to help the people bellow. It is less likely that you will clear the enemy tanks if you also have to worry about the grudge you have accumulated by the enemy pilots

    Again hawxeye I disagree lol! What about spotting in the planes? Has no benefits for infantry if the entire team is spotted up? Also me and my wingman take all the tanks out really fast if we want to. It's really easy to kill takes one pass. 2 good pilots will have the entire team spotted 80% of the time! Balance in the fighters is the problem because the German side has spotting capability in the fighters and the Brits don't you have to use a bomber variant. Really unfair when you have 4 really good pilots Fighting cause you don't wanna pull a bomber! If there was competitive play planes would have a huge role. Saying to me planes aren't helping infantry is crazy talk!
  • okiie_918
    130 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Raspu71nG wrote: »
    I think MAA ruins the game, they just camp inside their base the whole match on conquest mode, and IMO they are the lowest skilled players in the match that is why they use MAA. they are not good as a tanker or pilots.



    This is exactly what I call giving up on winning the game and in full kill plane mode! I call it a win when I am flying. Not only are you wasting a tank spawn but you are absolutely doing nothing but being a little annoying lol! It's the dumbest thing you can do really lol! It's way better to pull up on map and be like surprise AA tank in yo face! Usually what gets me in the air is well timed AA tank in a position over a objective. I am not ready for it and sometimes I fly right to it cause I have no clue where it is I just assume the enemy deployment lol! But don't tell anyone about it! Lol
  • VincentNZ
    2892 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    trip1ex said:
    some people get their panties in a twist too much over dying from a plane like they don't die otherwise.  lol.

    simple math says a pilot going 50-0 only kills every enemy player an average of  1 1/2 times per round.  that's not many deaths per player from a plane and 50-0 rounds don't grow on trees at least they didn't in BF1.  They  happened but not constantly.

    Meanwhile the average player  gets killed  by tanks and snipers and nades and bush wookies and shadowlords 10-20x more often.  But hey blame the planes for ruining the game.  


    This would hold true if everyone went 50-0 in this game. You get killed a lot more by the individual pilot that gets 50 kills than you get killed by the MMG prone guy going 17-8, which is an above average killcount. If we hypothetically look at the highest K/Ds per round chances are pretty high the pilots will be up there. Further the planes absolutely grow on trees, Fjell has 11 for example, which means one in six guys is in a plane and it is an immense force multiplier.
    They work solo at 100% efficiency, they have can simply outmaneuver any counter, infantry can not counter them, MAA only can deny a certain area and not available at all times and areas, SAA range and damage is sub-par, while all these counters are under the constant threat from everyone else on the field.
    Planes only have to worry about the other planes, while they can inflict heavy damage on the ground and herein lies the problem. If there is no real counter, fine, then you should not be able to do a lot of damage on the ground, simple as that.
  • trip1ex
    4770 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    VincentNZ said:
    trip1ex said:
    some people get their panties in a twist too much over dying from a plane like they don't die otherwise.  lol.

    simple math says a pilot going 50-0 only kills every enemy player an average of  1 1/2 times per round.  that's not many deaths per player from a plane and 50-0 rounds don't grow on trees at least they didn't in BF1.  They  happened but not constantly.

    Meanwhile the average player  gets killed  by tanks and snipers and nades and bush wookies and shadowlords 10-20x more often.  But hey blame the planes for ruining the game.  


    This would hold true if everyone went 50-0 in this game. You get killed a lot more by the individual pilot that gets 50 kills than you get killed by the MMG prone guy going 17-8, which is an above average killcount. If we hypothetically look at the highest K/Ds per round chances are pretty high the pilots will be up there. Further the planes absolutely grow on trees, Fjell has 11 for example, which means one in six guys is in a plane and it is an immense force multiplier.
    They work solo at 100% efficiency, they have can simply outmaneuver any counter, infantry can not counter them, MAA only can deny a certain area and not available at all times and areas, SAA range and damage is sub-par, while all these counters are under the constant threat from everyone else on the field.
    Planes only have to worry about the other planes, while they can inflict heavy damage on the ground and herein lies the problem. If there is no real counter, fine, then you should not be able to do a lot of damage on the ground, simple as that.
    That didn't make any sense.  :)



  • MintySSD
    39 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    I use the AA it annoys the pilots then they start coming for you and it helps your team pilots as well to get away repair.
  • VincentNZ
    2892 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    trip1ex said:
    VincentNZ said:
    trip1ex said:
    some people get their panties in a twist too much over dying from a plane like they don't die otherwise.  lol.

    simple math says a pilot going 50-0 only kills every enemy player an average of  1 1/2 times per round.  that's not many deaths per player from a plane and 50-0 rounds don't grow on trees at least they didn't in BF1.  They  happened but not constantly.

    Meanwhile the average player  gets killed  by tanks and snipers and nades and bush wookies and shadowlords 10-20x more often.  But hey blame the planes for ruining the game.  


    This would hold true if everyone went 50-0 in this game. You get killed a lot more by the individual pilot that gets 50 kills than you get killed by the MMG prone guy going 17-8, which is an above average killcount. If we hypothetically look at the highest K/Ds per round chances are pretty high the pilots will be up there. Further the planes absolutely grow on trees, Fjell has 11 for example, which means one in six guys is in a plane and it is an immense force multiplier.
    They work solo at 100% efficiency, they have can simply outmaneuver any counter, infantry can not counter them, MAA only can deny a certain area and not available at all times and areas, SAA range and damage is sub-par, while all these counters are under the constant threat from everyone else on the field.
    Planes only have to worry about the other planes, while they can inflict heavy damage on the ground and herein lies the problem. If there is no real counter, fine, then you should not be able to do a lot of damage on the ground, simple as that.
    That didn't make any sense.  :)



     I guess you mean the 50-0 part? Well let me try again. If player X goes 50-0 and we assume that all kills are done with the same probability then he will kill each player 1-2 times in a round. If infantry player Y goes 50-0 and we assume the same parameters he will also have killed everyone 1-2 times, regardless of the playstyle or if that is annoying to some. However, I would argue that a good pilot will with more ease reach 50-0 while it is infinitely harder to do so as infantry, especially with the mentioned playstyles. So the good MMG user, might have, in the same round 32-12 or something similar, which means, he will have only killed every enemy once per round.
    Added to that is that the plane has less chance of being destroyed, because there often is no counter available, while the MMG user can be countered by 32 players. That is why you will die more relatively speaking to good pilots, than to good infantry or tankers.
    There is that one guy that I keep running into, ibusbybear that is always in a plane, namely the Spitfire and he will regularly go 20-50:1-3, and that means, without hating on him, that he will be the reason why games are plain ruined, similar as when Stodeh joins.
  • Raspu71nG
    118 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    og baby a double!!! oh yeah!!!
    MAA always camping.
    kamikaze, and destroying two MAA at the same time.
    https://xboxclips.com/Raspu71nG/9b7cb558-6423-4050-bd3c-c3e3f21fd8f5
  • trip1ex
    4770 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    VincentNZ said:
    trip1ex said:
    VincentNZ said:
    trip1ex said:
    some people get their panties in a twist too much over dying from a plane like they don't die otherwise.  lol.

    simple math says a pilot going 50-0 only kills every enemy player an average of  1 1/2 times per round.  that's not many deaths per player from a plane and 50-0 rounds don't grow on trees at least they didn't in BF1.  They  happened but not constantly.

    Meanwhile the average player  gets killed  by tanks and snipers and nades and bush wookies and shadowlords 10-20x more often.  But hey blame the planes for ruining the game.  


    This would hold true if everyone went 50-0 in this game. You get killed a lot more by the individual pilot that gets 50 kills than you get killed by the MMG prone guy going 17-8, which is an above average killcount. If we hypothetically look at the highest K/Ds per round chances are pretty high the pilots will be up there. Further the planes absolutely grow on trees, Fjell has 11 for example, which means one in six guys is in a plane and it is an immense force multiplier.
    They work solo at 100% efficiency, they have can simply outmaneuver any counter, infantry can not counter them, MAA only can deny a certain area and not available at all times and areas, SAA range and damage is sub-par, while all these counters are under the constant threat from everyone else on the field.
    Planes only have to worry about the other planes, while they can inflict heavy damage on the ground and herein lies the problem. If there is no real counter, fine, then you should not be able to do a lot of damage on the ground, simple as that.
    That didn't make any sense.  :)



     I guess you mean the 50-0 part? Well let me try again. If player X goes 50-0 and we assume that all kills are done with the same probability then he will kill each player 1-2 times in a round. If infantry player Y goes 50-0 and we assume the same parameters he will also have killed everyone 1-2 times, regardless of the playstyle or if that is annoying to some. However, I would argue that a good pilot will with more ease reach 50-0 while it is infinitely harder to do so as infantry, especially with the mentioned playstyles. So the good MMG user, might have, in the same round 32-12 or something similar, which means, he will have only killed every enemy once per round.
    Added to that is that the plane has less chance of being destroyed, because there often is no counter available, while the MMG user can be countered by 32 players. That is why you will die more relatively speaking to good pilots, than to good infantry or tankers.
    There is that one guy that I keep running into, ibusbybear that is always in a plane, namely the Spitfire and he will regularly go 20-50:1-3, and that means, without hating on him, that he will be the reason why games are plain ruined, similar as when Stodeh joins.
    No I mean your entire post has no meaning in relation to my post.  

    The gist of what I said is a player gets killed way way more often by tanks and infantry way than by planes.

    And then you respond to me arguing a pilot can more easily get a great result (50-0) than a soldier on the ground.  

    Do you see the discrepancy here?  :)




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