Weekly Debrief

Battlefield V Will It Improve

Comments

  • Ploodovic
    1642 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    EA isn't going to abandon BFV, it's one of their flagship titles so they'll continue to release maps, patches etc. until BF6 launches.  But EA is having problems lately, their stock price is down, they've laid off staff, so I wouldn't look for BFV to get as much attention as it needs.  IMO one of the core problems with BFV is a tighter budget than previous titles, and that's due to EA's unfortunate business choices.  If they're arrogant enough to refuse to learn the lessons this game should have taught them, then I wouldn't expect BF6 to be any more successful than BFV.  EA says BFV sold as many copies as BF4, and obviously there is a steady supply of new purchasers based on all the low-rank players showing up, but it's still in the shadow of BF1 in terms of sales.  It's not a bad game, it just could have been considerably better.

    Seeing as BF1 is the best selling game in the series, all other Battlefields is in its shadow. When DICE announced BFV and talked about the design approach, no spotting, deadlier weapons, no health regeneration, it seemed like they were going for a more hardcore like experience. Considering hardcore was always the less popular option, my assumption would be that BFV wouldn’t be as popular as BF1. That it would sell less copies, because of its core design.

    That’s perfectly fine, of course, if you account for it. Knowing that you won’t surpass BF1 in sales, you can set expectations and budgets accordingly. But if you think you’re going to top BF1, then you’re in trouble.

    Even with the delayed release, the game wasn’t given enough time and/or resources, to be ready at launch, so maybe EA knew BFV wasn’t going to outsell BF1, but who knows?
  • sasqch10
    138 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    No. It will not. The core of the game is based on terrible, broken mechanics and game play that is not fun. What mode really shines in BF5!? None really. All have far more issues than enjoyment. One can get past them and have some moments of fun but they are usually overshadowed by the disasters of which BF5 is. that Most matches end in frustration from something stupid that should never have been made a in game design. The financial flop that it was has sealed the Pooh deal. What do you end up with no matter how much one shines a Pooh!? That is BF5 legacy
  • PoppaPappo
    236 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    G-Gnu said:

    CHAMMOND1992 said:
    EA is releasing another Star Wars game before the Rise of Skywalker releases in theaters. There's your answer on why there's barely any content in BFV. They have to allocate resources to ensure that game doesn't get delayed given that the movie has a set date.

    But that is not a DICE game , it is Respawn. 
    https://www.ea.com/games/starwars/jedi-fallen-order?isLocalized=true



    It doesn't matter. EA allocates developers between studios depending on the importance of the game. This was revealed in a Kotaku article about Anthem.


    My understanding of that article was that’s only true when Frostbite is involved. Frostbite is apparently so difficult to use they often have to take programmers from one team and put them on another game if they’re having trouble. They’re prioritized by how big the game is as well, which was part of what the article was talking about. BioWare really needed help with Anthem, but games life FIFA had higher priority, so they couldn’t get the help they needed and actually had their most experienced programmers taken off to work on other things.

    Seeing as how Respawn doesn’t use Frostbite, I don’t see this being the case here. How would DICE people help if Respawn is not even using Frostbite?
  • CHAMMOND1992
    1129 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    G-Gnu said:

    CHAMMOND1992 said:
    EA is releasing another Star Wars game before the Rise of Skywalker releases in theaters. There's your answer on why there's barely any content in BFV. They have to allocate resources to ensure that game doesn't get delayed given that the movie has a set date.

    But that is not a DICE game , it is Respawn. 
    https://www.ea.com/games/starwars/jedi-fallen-order?isLocalized=true



    It doesn't matter. EA allocates developers between studios depending on the importance of the game. This was revealed in a Kotaku article about Anthem.


    My understanding of that article was that’s only true when Frostbite is involved. Frostbite is apparently so difficult to use they often have to take programmers from one team and put them on another game if they’re having trouble. They’re prioritized by how big the game is as well, which was part of what the article was talking about. BioWare really needed help with Anthem, but games life FIFA had higher priority, so they couldn’t get the help they needed and actually had their most experienced programmers taken off to work on other things.

    Seeing as how Respawn doesn’t use Frostbite, I don’t see this being the case here. How would DICE people help if Respawn is not even using Frostbite?
    Doesn't matter the engine being used. If a studio is behind and it is imperative that it is released on schedule, you have to pool resources together to get it finished. The article simply showed a case where the problem was with Frostbite, not that its the only case where it is necessary to get other developers from other studios. DICE being most familiar with Frostbite certainly doesn't mean they can't work with other engines. Given the importance of this game and how the timing of release is essential to sales, it's not a stretch to assume this is happening.
  • LuckyULSA_NOR
    11 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    SirBobdk said:
    I will improve, but it will take a long time and may be too late.
    BC3 and BF6 will kill BFV before It reaches a quality level worthy of a BF game imo.
    y_j_es_i said:
    Give em a year. Like people have said, hopefully they’ll drop a treasure chest of maps and weapons when the Pacific’s released and by then most of the bugs and balance issues will hopefully have been worked out like it happened in BF4
    BF4 was fixed because EA told DICE to suspend work on everything else to focus on fixing that game.  They brought in DICE LA and Visceral helped too with the work they did on network performance in Hardline.  I doubt that many people are working on BFV, or that there is any sense of urgency over fixing and expanding this game.  Since no paid DLC have been announced there are no deadlines to meet, they can take their time and do as little as their reduced resources allow.  That's the appeal of Live Service to a company like EA, they aren't committed to anything, so they can release half a dozen more maps over the next year or so and act like that's all they ever planned to release.  They've made it so BF can be a smaller, shorter-lived game.  The long-time BF vets who remember how good this series once was won't like it, but EA doesn't care about that, they want skin sale profits like Epic makes in Fortnite, two billion last year.  For that kind of money EA would happily turn BF into a total cartoon, like Scooby-Doo with guns.

    Players care about games, corporations care only about profits.
    You are both on the money.
    EA doesn't give a **** about BFV. Its to late to rescue it....its down the drain.
    No popular streamers are streaming it, its gettings 0 value from other add places, and twitch withc is a very high end marketing place for games..........its dead.
    A year you say?
    A game does not last a year if its so badly built up reg. comm/gameplay/updates/MAPS as BFV is...its DEAD.

    THE ONLY THING THAT CAN SAVE THIS GAME IS IF DICE SUDDENLY DROPPED A MAP PACK OF AT LEAST 10 MAPS...and its not gonna happen..sorry :(

    BFV: RIP
  • diagoro
    1531 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    EA isn't going to abandon BFV, it's one of their flagship titles so they'll continue to release maps, patches etc. until BF6 launches.  But EA is having problems lately, their stock price is down, they've laid off staff, so I wouldn't look for BFV to get as much attention as it needs.  IMO one of the core problems with BFV is a tighter budget than previous titles, and that's due to EA's unfortunate business choices.  If they're arrogant enough to refuse to learn the lessons this game should have taught them, then I wouldn't expect BF6 to be any more successful than BFV.  EA says BFV sold as many copies as BF4, and obviously there is a steady supply of new purchasers based on all the low-rank players showing up, but it's still in the shadow of BF1 in terms of sales.  It's not a bad game, it just could have been considerably better.

    I almost want it to fail, as a wake up call to EA.

    The quality has been slowly spiraling dow, especially the shoddy patches, where its now assumed new bugs will get introduced. The poorly implemented Live service, and how Battlefront 2 and BF5 have near identical life cycles.....and failures.

    At some point both EA and Dice will have to take a hard look at themselves, decide a positive way to change their dev process.

    As for BF5, one can hope, but the writing is on the wall. We'll get drip fed buggy new content as slow as possible. They'll keep it alive in near coma status until BF6 shows, when it's just left to rot.
  • diagoro
    1531 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    GRAW2ROBZ wrote: »
    3 new maps within the next two months for regular game modes.  As well as 5vs5 game mode with new maps.  Besides possibly rent a server program pending.  Its getting there slow but surely.

    And these new game modes just recycle existing maps, making minor tweaks. Pretty much maximizing resources for the least anount of work.
  • mcRen98
    349 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited May 6
    diagoro said:
    GRAW2ROBZ wrote: »
    3 new maps within the next two months for regular game modes.  As well as 5vs5 game mode with new maps.  Besides possibly rent a server program pending.  Its getting there slow but surely.

    And these new game modes just recycle existing maps, making minor tweaks. Pretty much maximizing resources for the least anount of work.
    Eh...there has been datamined info alongside a conceptualised artwork of one of the locations of the 5v5 mode (Provence) as well as data for maps like Casquets (based on a raid on an island with a lighthouse), one of the devs replied some time after the second roadmap came out to a comment regarding the maps from the 5v5 mode and they are meant to be built from the ground up and not using any form of an existing map, it seems the gameplay data also seems to have alot of work put into it with faction doctrines, gadgets made specifically for the mode as well as abilities similar to soldier archetypes and 5v5 mode specific assets like the recon plane.
    https://www.reddit.com/r/BattlefieldV/comments/b4covb/bfv_data_mining_first_5v5_game_mode_details/
    https://www.reddit.com/r/BattlefieldV/comments/bbz726/bfv_data_mining_all_commando_traits_for_5v5_feat/

    https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/440962643109609473/558792230194905109/ynhx7czyvpn21.png


    The problem is that this is all well and good if the maps were actually designed for conquest, but like Firestorm they serve to only introduce a different element to the game which is the Siege style competitive scene and this would just alienate the large portion of the playerbase that wants to play mostly conquest and other core game modes. If the 5v5 mode like Firestorm gets drained of players then it only further proves just how much of a waste of alot of resources this game has utilised.
  • diagoro
    1531 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    mcRen98 wrote: »

    diagoro said:


    GRAW2ROBZ wrote: »
    3 new maps within the next two months for regular game modes.  As well as 5vs5 game mode with new maps.  Besides possibly rent a server program pending.  Its getting there slow but surely.



    And these new game modes just recycle existing maps, making minor tweaks. Pretty much maximizing resources for the least anount of work.

    Eh...there has been datamined info alongside a conceptualised artwork of one of the locations of the 5v5 mode (Provence) as well as data for maps like Casquets (based on a raid on an island with a lighthouse), one of the devs replied some time after the second roadmap came out to a comment regarding the maps from the 5v5 mode and they are meant to be built from the ground up and not using any form of an existing map, it seems the gameplay data also seems to have alot of work put into it with faction doctrines, gadgets made specifically for the mode as well as abilities similar to soldier archetypes and 5v5 mode specific assets like the recon plane.
    https://www.reddit.com/r/BattlefieldV/comments/b4covb/bfv_data_mining_first_5v5_game_mode_details/
    https://www.reddit.com/r/BattlefieldV/comments/bbz726/bfv_data_mining_all_commando_traits_for_5v5_feat/

    https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/440962643109609473/558792230194905109/ynhx7czyvpn21.png


    The problem is that this is all well and good if the maps were actually designed for conquest, but like Firestorm they serve to only introduce a different element to the game which is the Siege style competitive scene and this would just alienate the large portion of the playerbase that wants to play mostly conquest and other core game modes. If the 5v5 mode like Firestorm gets drained of players then it only further proves just how much of a waste of alot of resources this game has utilised.

    Especially if the mode is only available for a limited time.

    No idea why they don't just develop new 64 player maps.
  • Redstripe101
    2559 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    G-Gnu wrote: »
    CHAMMOND1992 said:

    G-Gnu said:

    CHAMMOND1992 said:
    EA is releasing another Star Wars game before the Rise of Skywalker releases in theaters. There's your answer on why there's barely any content in BFV. They have to allocate resources to ensure that game doesn't get delayed given that the movie has a set date.

    But that is not a DICE game , it is Respawn. 
    https://www.ea.com/games/starwars/jedi-fallen-order?isLocalized=true



    It doesn't matter. EA allocates developers between studios depending on the importance of the game.
    You think they have drawn resources from DICE to Respawn , maybe.

    I could see it, EA predicted Anthem and BF5 to succeed, and actually couldnt predict Apex when Respawn came to them with it. So they let them just run with it without EA influence to see how it does. With its success, I could see the need for help but I wouldnt want DICE covering down on it. If so then watch its position drop, I'd bet money on it tbh.
  • LuckyULSA_NOR
    11 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    diagoro said:
    mcRen98 wrote: »

    diagoro said:


    GRAW2ROBZ wrote: »
    3 new maps within the next two months for regular game modes.  As well as 5vs5 game mode with new maps.  Besides possibly rent a server program pending.  Its getting there slow but surely.



    And these new game modes just recycle existing maps, making minor tweaks. Pretty much maximizing resources for the least anount of work.

    Eh...there has been datamined info alongside a conceptualised artwork of one of the locations of the 5v5 mode (Provence) as well as data for maps like Casquets (based on a raid on an island with a lighthouse), one of the devs replied some time after the second roadmap came out to a comment regarding the maps from the 5v5 mode and they are meant to be built from the ground up and not using any form of an existing map, it seems the gameplay data also seems to have alot of work put into it with faction doctrines, gadgets made specifically for the mode as well as abilities similar to soldier archetypes and 5v5 mode specific assets like the recon plane.
    https://www.reddit.com/r/BattlefieldV/comments/b4covb/bfv_data_mining_first_5v5_game_mode_details/
    https://www.reddit.com/r/BattlefieldV/comments/bbz726/bfv_data_mining_all_commando_traits_for_5v5_feat/

    https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/440962643109609473/558792230194905109/ynhx7czyvpn21.png


    The problem is that this is all well and good if the maps were actually designed for conquest, but like Firestorm they serve to only introduce a different element to the game which is the Siege style competitive scene and this would just alienate the large portion of the playerbase that wants to play mostly conquest and other core game modes. If the 5v5 mode like Firestorm gets drained of players then it only further proves just how much of a waste of alot of resources this game has utilised.

    Especially if the mode is only available for a limited time.

    No idea why they don't just develop new 64 player maps.
     Yeeees its geeeetttting theeeere......
    BFV was not meant to last.....they only made us veterans pay full price....then dump it with a 50% discount....THANKS DICE AND EA

  • Redstripe101
    2559 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    diagoro said:


    mcRen98 wrote: »


    diagoro said:





    GRAW2ROBZ wrote: »

    3 new maps within the next two months for regular game modes.  As well as 5vs5 game mode with new maps.  Besides possibly rent a server program pending.  Its getting there slow but surely.







    And these new game modes just recycle existing maps, making minor tweaks. Pretty much maximizing resources for the least anount of work.



    Eh...there has been datamined info alongside a conceptualised artwork of one of the locations of the 5v5 mode (Provence) as well as data for maps like Casquets (based on a raid on an island with a lighthouse), one of the devs replied some time after the second roadmap came out to a comment regarding the maps from the 5v5 mode and they are meant to be built from the ground up and not using any form of an existing map, it seems the gameplay data also seems to have alot of work put into it with faction doctrines, gadgets made specifically for the mode as well as abilities similar to soldier archetypes and 5v5 mode specific assets like the recon plane.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/BattlefieldV/comments/b4covb/bfv_data_mining_first_5v5_game_mode_details/

    https://www.reddit.com/r/BattlefieldV/comments/bbz726/bfv_data_mining_all_commando_traits_for_5v5_feat/



    https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/440962643109609473/558792230194905109/ynhx7czyvpn21.png





    The problem is that this is all well and good if the maps were actually designed for conquest, but like Firestorm they serve to only introduce a different element to the game which is the Siege style competitive scene and this would just alienate the large portion of the playerbase that wants to play mostly conquest and other core game modes. If the 5v5 mode like Firestorm gets drained of players then it only further proves just how much of a waste of alot of resources this game has utilised.



    Especially if the mode is only available for a limited time.



    No idea why they don't just develop new 64 player maps.

     Yeeees its geeeetttting theeeere......
    BFV was not meant to last.....they only made us veterans pay full price....then dump it with a 50% discount....THANKS DICE AND EA

    I chuckle when I see the Boin ad splash screen in BF4, not today **** lol
  • THERAMPAGE_ci0h
    172 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Players: Game is bugged !
    Dice: Soon!
    *patch appears*
    Players: Game is bugged even more !
    Dice: We will work on that !
    ... Time pass ...
    Players: Game is still bugged & we lack of content !
    Dice: Here, buy some amputed content skins with real money !
    Players: We need more maps, anti cheat & real content !
    Dice: Here, buy some elite skins ! 
    Players : *Left this game*
    Dice:  :open_mouth:
  • parkingbrake
    3202 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    sasqch10 said:
    No. It will not. The core of the game is based on terrible, broken mechanics and game play that is not fun. What mode really shines in BF5!? None really. All have far more issues than enjoyment. One can get past them and have some moments of fun but they are usually overshadowed by the disasters of which BF5 is. that Most matches end in frustration from something stupid that should never have been made a in game design. The financial flop that it was has sealed the Pooh deal. What do you end up with no matter how much one shines a Pooh!? That is BF5 legacy
    You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but for the most part I'm okay with the gameplay of BFV (with the exception of the poor network performance).  It's mostly outside issues like no rented servers and the horrible Live Service business model which are dragging down this game IMO.  Of course every patch brings bugs, but they're usually annoying rather than game-breaking and often they're fixed in the next patch (which will naturally introduce some other bug).

    I have some frustrating rounds, team balance is often a problem, but I have enjoyable games too, with close scores and lots of action.  It's a shame you didn't experience that.
  • parkingbrake
    3202 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    diagoro said:
    EA isn't going to abandon BFV, it's one of their flagship titles so they'll continue to release maps, patches etc. until BF6 launches.  But EA is having problems lately, their stock price is down, they've laid off staff, so I wouldn't look for BFV to get as much attention as it needs.  IMO one of the core problems with BFV is a tighter budget than previous titles, and that's due to EA's unfortunate business choices.  If they're arrogant enough to refuse to learn the lessons this game should have taught them, then I wouldn't expect BF6 to be any more successful than BFV.  EA says BFV sold as many copies as BF4, and obviously there is a steady supply of new purchasers based on all the low-rank players showing up, but it's still in the shadow of BF1 in terms of sales.  It's not a bad game, it just could have been considerably better.

    I almost want it to fail, as a wake up call to EA.

    The quality has been slowly spiraling dow, especially the shoddy patches, where its now assumed new bugs will get introduced. The poorly implemented Live service, and how Battlefront 2 and BF5 have near identical life cycles.....and failures.

    At some point both EA and Dice will have to take a hard look at themselves, decide a positive way to change their dev process.

    As for BF5, one can hope, but the writing is on the wall. We'll get drip fed buggy new content as slow as possible. They'll keep it alive in near coma status until BF6 shows, when it's just left to rot.


    The buggy patches are nothing new, the same thing happened in BF3, BF4, BF1....  DICE has a long history of fixing one thing and breaking another, that didn't begin in BFV.  As you say, the big problem is the business model, EA clearly doesn't know how to make Live Service work.

    I don't think this will change without a major management shakeup at EA, right to the top.  EA has become so big that arrogance is their defining characteristic.  They've lost touch with why we buy games, and all they can think about is the billions companies like Epic are making from the sale of skins.
  • sabootheshaman
    1112 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    G-Gnu wrote: »
    CHAMMOND1992 said:

    G-Gnu said:

    CHAMMOND1992 said:
    EA is releasing another Star Wars game before the Rise of Skywalker releases in theaters. There's your answer on why there's barely any content in BFV. They have to allocate resources to ensure that game doesn't get delayed given that the movie has a set date.

    But that is not a DICE game , it is Respawn. 
    https://www.ea.com/games/starwars/jedi-fallen-order?isLocalized=true



    It doesn't matter. EA allocates developers between studios depending on the importance of the game.
    You think they have drawn resources from DICE to Respawn , maybe.

    I could see it, EA predicted Anthem and BF5 to succeed, and actually couldnt predict Apex when Respawn came to them with it. So they let them just run with it without EA influence to see how it does. With its success, I could see the need for help but I wouldnt want DICE covering down on it. If so then watch its position drop, I'd bet money on it tbh.

    No way DICE devs are on Respawn projects unless they are non engine devs. Fallen order is on Unreal engine. APEX is source. It’s a ridiculous hyperbolic statement by the original commenter.
  • DJTN1
    306 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Resources? Have you looked at the credits in this game? There are thousands and thousands of engineers and artists. Heck, there is an entire section with multiple studios just working on the Frostbite engine alone. And look at the state of this game!

    Say what you want but I don't believe the problem is resources. Looks more like poor management and game changing decisions being made up until release day. This game has been in production for over six months and still plays like beta code. That's my experience anyway...

    ✌️
  • CHAMMOND1992
    1129 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    DJTN1 said:
    Resources? Have you looked at the credits in this game? There are thousands and thousands of engineers and artists. Heck, there is an entire section with multiple studios just working on the Frostbite engine alone. And look at the state of this game!

    Say what you want but I don't believe the problem is resources. Looks more like poor management and game changing decisions being made up until release day. This game has been in production for over six months and still plays like beta code. That's my experience anyway...

    ✌️
    Yeah, and there aren't "thousands and thousands" of SOFTWARE ENGINEERS. You're drunk, go home.
  • sabootheshaman
    1112 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    DJTN1 said:
    Resources? Have you looked at the credits in this game? There are thousands and thousands of engineers and artists. Heck, there is an entire section with multiple studios just working on the Frostbite engine alone. And look at the state of this game!

    Say what you want but I don't believe the problem is resources. Looks more like poor management and game changing decisions being made up until release day. This game has been in production for over six months and still plays like beta code. That's my experience anyway...

    ✌️
    Yeah, and there aren't "thousands and thousands" of SOFTWARE ENGINEERS. You're drunk, go home.
    I don't necessarily think he is correct either but you think switching engines is going to be quick and easy for a dev? Sweet, cos I'll just pull some .net devs to work on this php project... You are making generalisations about things you appear to know little about. 

    My guess is the problems are more complex than any of us really know and likely a combination of multiple things including resources, management, workflows, UX vs  the overall architecture of core systems and just fundamental flaws in Frostbite now coming to the surface.
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