It's a shame more people don't talk about WW1

M_Rat13
1505 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
When you play operations in BF1, you are put in the shoes of the people who fought in those battles, with them telling you what they thought just before the battle. I recently started thinking, why is WW1 not talked about more? Because honestly, from the perspective of BF1, it comes across as a very human war. No one is shown as the villain, each side is relatable. At least from a troops on the ground perspective. That's something we really need right now, and not the WW2 perspective of there being some great villain we have to overcome. If we all realized, we are just all humans, by hearing more about WW1, I think the world would be a better place.

Comments

  • RossP317
    248 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited May 27
    Not sure where in the world you are but here in Scotland WW1 is still part of the compulsory school curriculum. I'm pretty sure it is in the rest of the UK as well.

    My own interest in the subject comes from a school trip to Flanders and the Somme 30 years ago. Once you see the mass graveyards you don't forget them in a hurry. That is why I bought BF1 in the first place. I'm not a fan of modern era FPS games normally but the historical context interested me.
  • Trokey66
    8987 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    RossP317 wrote: »
    Not sure where in the world you are but here in Scotland WW1 is still part of the compulsory school curriculum. I'm pretty sure it is in the rest of the UK as well.

    My own interest in the subject comes from a school trip to Flanders and the Somme 30 years ago. Once you see the mass graveyards you don't forget them in a hurry. That is why I bought BF1 in the first place. I'm not a fan of modern era FPS games normally but the historical context interested me.

    I think it should be compulsory for every British school kid to visit the likes of Tynecot Cemetery or the Menin Gate etc.

    Put things into perspective.
  • ElliotLH
    9359 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    As above we did a module on WWI when I was at school in England. This was decades ago but I imagine this is still the case. There's also usually a large turnout on Remembrance Day, which is always nice to see.

    I also read a book recently that went through all the soldiers who died from the area I grew up in (including a couple of relatives from my Mum's side) and that was an incredibly humbling read.
  • PackersDK
    877 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited May 27
    I live in a country that was neutral during WW1, but still it’s a part of our Modern History curriculum.

    Perhaps it depends on where in the world you live, what school you go to or perhaps even your history teacher, but I don’t find WW1 to be forgotten, or even overlooked. 

    As a history teacher I know you simply can’t teach much of 20th century history without pulling at threads that goes back to WW1. Be it everything from communism, womens rights, colonialism to WW2. 

    I agree with the OP that WW1 can teach us alot, but I disagree that we are in fact not already doing that here in the 21st century. 
  • MarxistDictator
    5177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Well considering the Germans would have won in 1916 and not forced reparation payments on any powers anyone with a history book can see there were clear victims and good guys. Who extended the war and starved the citizens of another county? Who put impossibly unfair reparations on the other that ultimately caused the next war? I know we have a lot of pride but even as a Canadian I know we were totally in the wrong and set into discourse the explosively wrong turn of events for the rest of the 20th century in WW1 and simply because we didn’t accept peace when it was offered with no losers.
  • PackersDK
    877 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited May 28
    Well considering the Germans would have won in 1916 and not forced reparation payments on any powers anyone with a history book can see there were clear victims and good guys. Who extended the war and starved the citizens of another county? Who put impossibly unfair reparations on the other that ultimately caused the next war? I know we have a lot of pride but even as a Canadian I know we were totally in the wrong and set into discourse the explosively wrong turn of events for the rest of the 20th century in WW1 and simply because we didn’t accept peace when it was offered with no losers.

    That is a pretty one-sided account.

    The Central Powers made crushing demands for peace with Romania and Russia, at the treaties of Brest-Litovsk and Bucharest in 1918. The Entente had in no way a patent on imposing harsh peace terms on defeated enemies.

    The unrestricted u-boat warfare was meant to starve Britain. The Entente did a better job, but Germany in no way has some moral upper hand there. 

    How do you know there would be “no losers”, based on a peace conference in 1916 which was not held?? Do you have some glass ball that reveals alternate history?? Germany at that point occupied industrially very important parts of Northern France, most of Belgium and present day Poland. A peace conference would have reflected that, and in no way would the Central Powers just have said “we don’t want anything”.

    France had every right to decline a peace offer with parts of their country under occupation. 

    Blaming WW2 on Versailles, and thus on the Entente, and saying “we were totally in the wrong” strikes me as being a bit masochistic. The Versailles Treaty is complicated. There were different types (A, B and C bonds) and rates of repayment schedule.

    Reperations was actually cancelled completely at the Lausanne Conference in.... 1932. Well before WW2. But the Depression happened. And Italian fascism. And a host of other things that lead to 1939. 

    I’m not saying the Versailles Treaty didn’t play a role in bringing WW2 about, but you do seem to put too much weight on that point.

    Your post is too hard on the Entente, too lenient on the Central Powers, and there’s too much 20/20 hindsight in it. Sorry if that is harsh, but that is my humble opinion.
  • ronybaloney
    304 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    I'm no history expert, but one lesson from WW1 people should be more aware of, is how much of the problems we have today in the Middle East can be directly traced back to US/France/UK carving up the various countries and tribal areas willy-nilly after the war and breaking all kinds of promises we made to them for helping us out. Sometimes the spoils of War can come back to haunt you.
  • MarxistDictator
    5177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    No crystal ball needed. Britain literally withheld that information from their populace who would have no doubt gone for it if they had at any point been made aware of it. Britain was at best 2 weeks from surrender from the efficacy of their u boat warfare and the best of the French army had all but capitulated under ruinously poor morale and bad leadership. After the Tsar folded the international financiers (Zionists) approached Britain with a literal deal of the devil, the Balfour declaration. Brest-Litovosk was a treaty from a total power position for the central powers and it was no where near as unfair as the terms of the Versailles treaty. So yeah I can literally say their separate claim for pro bono peace with the western allies would have been in the better interest of 10+ million people who would have otherwise not died if the war didn’t go on 2 more years, easily. It becomes even more obvious when you throw the 60 million dead from WW2 on top of that figure. The entente not only postured world politics such that war was inevitable in WW1 they did it again with WW2. Bad guys 2 times in a row.
  • Tunza42
    33 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Good.  Been the bad guys is always more fun
  • PackersDK
    877 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited May 29
    No crystal ball needed. Britain literally withheld that information from their populace who would have no doubt gone for it if they had at any point been made aware of it. Britain was at best 2 weeks from surrender from the efficacy of their u boat warfare and the best of the French army had all but capitulated under ruinously poor morale and bad leadership. After the Tsar folded the international financiers (Zionists) approached Britain with a literal deal of the devil, the Balfour declaration. Brest-Litovosk was a treaty from a total power position for the central powers and it was no where near as unfair as the terms of the Versailles treaty. So yeah I can literally say their separate claim for pro bono peace with the western allies would have been in the better interest of 10+ million people who would have otherwise not died if the war didn’t go on 2 more years, easily. It becomes even more obvious when you throw the 60 million dead from WW2 on top of that figure. The entente not only postured world politics such that war was inevitable in WW1 they did it again with WW2. Bad guys 2 times in a row.

    There were numerous peace proposals as early as from 1914. I don’t think you’ve researched enough how vague the Bethman-Hollweg one of Dec. 1916 was. Politicians are elected to make decisions, even difficult ones in wartime, they are not elected to ask the population what they think should be done. Being a moral judge 100 years later is just too easy. 

    I don’t see any moral difference between Brest-Litovsk and Versailles.

    On a minor sidenote; I can’t help noticing how Britain was the baddies because of their blockade, whereas (according to you) Germany strangling Britain to within 2 weeks of surrender by u-boats doesn’t deserve any moral condemnation from you. Just that Britain ought to have capitulated. 

    But anyhow; I can’t really debate anyone who expects Entente politicians in 1916 to forsee WW2, and lay 60 mill. deaths at their feet. That is just incredibly unfair. If you were my student in History class I’d say that’s not a serious approach to history. 

    Let’s agree to disagree and not hi-jack the thread with a discussion I suspect will go nowhere. I’m gonna play some BF1 now. 

    Have a nice weekend.
  • MarxistDictator
    5177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Yeah because it’s part of war. While Germany was blockading Britain Germany was getting choked off from international shipping as well as from the Middle East, also heavily disrupted. The Ottoman Empire was paralyzed because of their reliance on rails that were constantly sabotaged. You can pick apart total war all you want and find plenty of bad on both sides, what is properly identifying of who was on the side of peace in world history was those who were trying to avoid conflict. Having the governments of 3 nations decide almost 2 decades before the war began to unite to destroy Germany certainly didn’t help the peace process nor did setting up a treaty that completely destroyed them as an empire and economic power. They wanted to get out of the war just as soon as it started, since they had no real interest in it.
  • TheGM86
    875 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    I'm no history expert, but one lesson from WW1 people should be more aware of, is how much of the problems we have today in the Middle East can be directly traced back to US carving up the various countries and tribal areas willy-nilly after the war
  • Prep768
    3476 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited May 29
    Wasn't there that young chap on Good Morning Britain that people shouldn't learn about the war cos its too depressing? Edit:


  • Tunza42
    33 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    @MarxistDictator you realise that the idea of the German/Aryan master race existed even before WW1 started?  'Ethnic cleansing' was important to ensure more living space for the German people.  Expansion was their main goal.

    Entente victory + Versailles = Britain and her allies gassed the Jews is a little bit of a far reach mate. 

    "They wanted to get out of the war just as soon as it started, since they had no real interest in it" - No, they wanted free reign to do whatever they liked across Europe without any resistance.  The whole of Europe was their birthright after all.

    But sure, the world would be a much better place today if the central powers were victorious in 1916.

  • MarxistDictator
    5177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Here comes another aspect of the historical whitewash. You know that ‘all Europeans’ were the ones considered Aryans by the National Socialists (or if you want to go even earlier Germans under the Kaiser), not people with blonde hair and blue eyes, if they are at all relevant to this discussion. What Germany reclaimed were much of the German territories they lost because of the war. No one batted an eye at the USSR invading Poland despite claiming the violation of Poland as the justification for declaring war against Germany and allies. No one prosecuted the thousands of allied and Red Army soldiers who ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ and murdered civilians and POWs at the end of WW2.

    I will say that Britain offering Palestine both as a Jewish homeland and as a reward to the Arabs who fought and liberated it is completely despicable and illegal in any sense of the meaning of the word ‘law’ as well. Ethnic cleansing is very important to the Israelis despite being victims of the same, how odd. You really don’t want to invite comparisons when defending an apartheid ethnostate that suppresses the rights of the majority that live there.
  • Tunza42
    33 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited May 30
    The world would be a much better place today if the central powers were victorious in 1916.  It is very clear to me now.  You seem to know exactly what would have happened had things in WW1 gone as you say.

    Maybe you should use these super powers for some good? Let all the world leaders know what decisions they should be making for the betterment of all humanity? Granted, there is no way to ensure that they follow your advice, but at least if they know what the outcomes of a decision will be in advance, the blood will be on their hands should they choose to ignore your divine intervention.

    It is insane how people continue to speculate the infinite outcomes that could have manifested from decisions made 100 years ago when they could just ask you for the only outcome possible (In the case of this discussion Brest-Litovsk peace treaty been implemented in 1916).  We could avoid so many mistakes!  Please use your powers for good.

    Godspeed.





    *Edited for spelling corrections
  • MarxistDictator
    5177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited May 30
    Is that more refusal to engage the content and instead attack the messenger? Like I said if you want to go back and pretend everything the allies did was somehow justifiable and good then sure, go ahead and gulp that koolaid. You already tipped off that’s your entire understanding of WW2 as well anyway. Remember that to be in your camp you have to believe in horrendous outrage Soviet propaganda with no proof and believe that an apartheid state is legitimate along with condoning the murder of civilians and PoWs. Not so nice to get painted with a brush based on your beliefs hey
  • Tunza42
    33 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Heh,  I have no idea what thread you are reading.  It must not be this one though because I looked back at my posts to see how you could deduce the conclusion you came to about my beliefs and understanding of both world wars and could not find it.  I am happy for you to point it out for me though :).  Thanks

    P.S What camp am I in exactly?
    PPS What happens to the Ottoman empire when the CP 'make peace' in 1916?
  • PSJackman4
    202 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Yeah BF1 was great and always will be. Would want to see another WW1 BF game again covering other factions like Japan and Bulgaria. 
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