How can you use the Ilya Muromets Bomber effectively?

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CFPA_Football
36 postsMember, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member

The Ilya Muromets Bomber is neat because it is so big and has a alot of potential as a bomb dropper. At times I have been on maps like Cape Helles where the enemy had very skilled pilots and repeatedly bombed me at choke points in front of the flags so that my team was hardly able to advance and my team lost. Other Ilya pilots have commented that they love to use the Ilya bomber when the enemy gets too tough for them on maps like Galicia.

How do you use this bomber? I have flown it or ridden as one of the two gunners maybe 20-40 times already - enough to make 9 kills with it, but it's difficult to fly and about as difficult to make kills with for me - IOW, I have big problems both flying and shooting with it. Of course, the first problem that comes up is that it's not available on alot of maps, and even when it comes up, I die quickly flying it, either from accidents or from enemies shooting. So I just get a few chances every few maps to use it.

The second problem is flying it. It is pretty slow, which is OK when it comes to making sure that it flies straight and making sure that you know where it is going. But the slowness also makes it very slow to turn. So most times when I start flying it, it ends up going out of bounds. Basically, I make a run over a target, and then I immediately need to think about turning it around, both to make a second run on the target and to make sure that it doesn't go out of bounds. And depending on the map, the boundaries of the play field can be set so close to the target capture flags that even when I am turning as hard as I can in an out of bounds area, I can't get it back into the playing zone before the 10 second count runs out and I am considered a "deserter."

The third problem is shooting targets. There are three tools if you are the pilot. The first tool is the cluster bombs, which I have made maybe two kills total with, and are the primary weapon. The first problem with using the bombs is that you have a tough idea of where your targets are. You can make a general guess that they are in a circle around the enemy flags, or you can see a few tiny dots near the flags. Next, you can fly your plane over or close above the enemy flags. You must also drop your bombs near the enemy flags. This sounds pretty simple. But it's not as if you are looking at the ground where your bombs are going to fall at the same moment that you drop your bombs. You of course can guess with timing about where your bomb will land based on an imagined arc drawn based on your height and speed from the ground. But I don't have much way of knowing what that arc looks like because I don't see the ground at the moment that I fly over it, nor is there a crosshairs or red dot highlighted onto the ground to show me where it will fall.

Your second weapon is your machine gun as a pilot, but that's hard to use too because it aims and shoots sideways from the direction of your flight path. Plus, your gun barrel feels pretty slow to move within your flight path due to the fact that it seems fixed to your plane and the way to aim the barrel seems to be to tilt your plane. In a sense, this would be like having to aim a machine gun by moving the angle of your whole body while running instead of just moving your wrist or arm by themselves.

Your third weapon is your camera. I take it that this weapon highlights as Red Targets the enemies that it photographs. I guess that this is kind of helpful for your teammates on the ground or a bit helpful if you succeed in turning your slow-moving plane around 180 degrees and flying over the same target area again.

Comments

  • HugoPlayNow
    167 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    lol...the planes are tough and there are tons of pilots who are so much better than me and hand me my ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ time and time again.

    The ONE tip I can give is when flying your plane, use the 3rd person POV...then when you get level and lined up with your target, then toggle to FPV so you can use the bomb site.

    ...and hope you don't get shot down before you can drop your payload...lol.
  • Titan_Awaken
    1193 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    It’s quite simple... you don’t.

    No seriously. The attack plane and fighter plane (or even the regular bomber) variants are better than the flying coffin bomber (Muromets).

    No pilot who is serious about farming infantry or dominating the skies will pick a Muromets because its cons greatly outweighs its pros.
  • CFPA_Football
    36 postsMember, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    The ONE tip I can give is when flying your plane, use the 3rd person POV...then when you get level and lined up with your target, then toggle to FPV so you can use the bomb site.

    ...and hope you don't get shot down before you can drop your payload...lol.
    Thanks, Hugo. Sure, when I fly, I use the third person view. 
    When it comes to toggling to FPV, does the location that shows up on the screen correspond to the bomb site? For example, let's say that you are in first person view looking ahead out your pilot window. That's a pretty big area, and it's hard to tell where your bomb would hit.
    Likewise, if you press the "Zoom/Scope" button while flying in FPV, you get a circle view of an area under your plane and you can photograph it with your plane camera. Maybe this circular area is what you are referring to, but when I look at it, I am not sure if this is the area that my bomb will hit, because normally when flying a plane and dropping a bomb, the landing site will depend on the curved arc derived from your own speed and flightpath instead of just landing on the square yard or so that is straight under your plane at the moment that you open the hatch. Is the area in your pilot's "Zoom" circle the same area where your bomb will hit? 
  • Forkbeard84
    1838 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    I believe whatever your bomb site is pointing at is what will be hit when you drop the bomb.  You don't need to lead and such, just drop the bombs when the site is centered on the target.  I'm no expert though.  Pilot level 5 still after all this time.

    Also what does the photograph do?  Does it spot everything in the bomb site?
  • CFPA_Football
    36 postsMember, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member


    Also what does the photograph do?  Does it spot everything in the bomb site?
    I believe so.
  • CFPA_Football
    36 postsMember, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Here is a photo posted on Reddit two years ago from UrbanWalrus complaining that the Ilya was overpowered:

    Apparently, he got those stats while playing as an Ilya pilot.
    SOURCE: https://www.reddit.com/r/battlefield_one/comments/89lcf4/ilya_muromets_is_¯\_(ツ)_/¯_ridicilious_sorry_for/

    So certainly there are players like him who are amazing at using the plane. It may not actually be that the plane is overpowered like he complained: the issue could be that it has the potential to be an amazing tool and that he uses this well.

    In contrast, I have trouble turning it so it avoids going out of bounds, making sure it goes over targets, aiming its bombs and gun at targets, etc. etc. etc. It seems to demand coordination powers beyond mine. 

    FWIW, I found flying planes on the 2000's game BF1942 awkward too. But there are good pilots.
  • Trokey66
    8987 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited July 1
    The Murmonts is an abomination that should not be in the game.

    Anything that can do this with minimal input from the player is ridiculous.....

    Post edited by Trokey66 on
  • CFPA_Football
    36 postsMember, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited June 30
    Trokey66 said:
    The Murmonts is an abomination that should be in the game.

    Anything that can do this with minimal input from the player is ridiculous.....
    Trokey66 said:
    The Murmonts is an abomination that should be in the game.

    Anything that can do this with minimal input from the player is ridiculous.....


    I agree that it's a strong weapon, but it seems like you need to figure it out and get the skill for it.
    The video that you posted was helpful because it shows that you need to look through the scope.

    In the video, the plane flies at the target head on and goes above the flag. But in practice, I can find myself flying at an angle or not going right over the flag. Also in the video, there is a big group of enemies in one place, so that the pilot can make the 17 person kill. In practice, the enemies can be more spread out. Also, in the video the pilot smoothly goes from third person view to FPV and then zoom while still flying the plane straight. But in practice, it feels like getting a trick of complicated button pushing and button holding in the right order to do all this.

    With repeated attempts I can learn the skill, but probably most maps don't have an Ilya bomber, and even the ones that do map only make 3 bombers available in a round, and some other player could get to it first to fly it.
  • HANSGRUBER30
    3066 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    It’s quite simple... you don’t.

    No seriously. The attack plane and fighter plane (or even the regular bomber) variants are better than the flying coffin bomber (Muromets).

    No pilot who is serious about farming infantry or dominating the skies will pick a Muromets because its cons greatly outweighs its pros.
    I would agree with Titan_Awaken that the heavy bomber is probably not the best choice. Yes you can get some games with a massive KD using it but only if the opposition let you by not using the AA guns, attack/fighter planes or small arms fire to stop you. Here are my thoughts on the heavy bomber.

    AA guns are probably the biggest threat to the heavy bomber as you are flying a big slow moving aircraft that even the most blind team mate can hit. If your heavy bomber comes under fire from a AA position there are only 3 likely out comes.
    1. You get killed, not ideal!
    2. You bail out before the bomber goes boom. Still not ideal but still alive (for now)
    3. The AA gunner gets sniped and you get to bomb the objective. Though using a AA gun usually gets you a bullet in the head the enemy have a annoying habit of only doing this after they have shot You down.
    You could try flying low to avoid the most of the AA fire but you will have every infantry player and tanker shooting at you. If it's one thing that cheers the poor bloody infantry up is downing a heavy bomber. I've brought down a fair few heavy bomber with my M1917 and what ever tank I'm driving.

    Other planes will see you as easy pray, it's defence are both strong and weak at the same time. The rear cannon is very strong at fending off other planes if you can get a team mate to keep a eye out for other aircraft but most of the time they will be to busy shooting at the ground as the plane burns around them. The forward firing AA machine gun is useless with only a 180 degree field of fire plus it's a boring position to use as all you see is sky (shooting a empty sky seems more boring than shooting a empty Mountain side it seems) so you are unlikely to get a team mate to use it in the first place.

    You can use the HB slow speed against other planes as they might have break off their attack on you if you slow right down. But one tactic my clan use against the heavy bomber when using the attack plane is to shoot it up from the rear doing as much damage possible and then flying along side it out of reach from its defence weapons and let the rear gunner finish it off in safety. Works every time, unless it's a random in the back who'll ignore the near dead easy kill burning bomber and instead start shooting at that mountain side. (How much points does killing a mountain give you?)

    As for why I rate the attack plane higher is it's far more tactically flexible, you can bomb the infantry to kingdom come dropping signal flares as you go helping out you guys on the ground and do a bit of dog fighting as well, even against fighters, if the enemy isn't that great a flyer. Which on the hole make it a lot more fun to use. The fighters are a lot more fun to fly but after you shoot down a few planes most of the time the enemy give up (like I do if I'm up against the Ifly clan) and your left buzzing flags hoping to get a kill or two. The trench fighter was the best aircraft back in the day but got hit by the next hammer hard! Now on the rare occasions I get killed by it I get all nostalgic.

    Sorry it's more my thoughts on how to kill rather than how to use a heavy bomber, but I hope it gives you a useful insight.


  • WetFishDB
    2314 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Trokey66 said:
    The Murmonts is an abomination that should be in the game.

    Anything that can do this with minimal input from the player is ridiculous.....

    image
    Not often that Trokey and I agree on things, but this I am with him 100% ;)

    It's not that the Murometes doesn't have counters, as it does - but it IS imbalanced.  The high health is balanced by its low manoeuvrability, but its blast radius is waaay too large and it's risk/reward trade-off is waaaay off.  Just look at that video!  Even with LOTS of people shooting at it in the video that person is able to get 17 kills for 1 death by flying in a straight line and dropping their bombs on one run.  Respawn and repeat.  And from the height that person was flying I'm not sure they are even a particularly good Murometes pilot.  The smarter ones fly at height ceiling so that only certain guns can reach them, which is a real problem when some maps are terrible for AA positioning (Albion Conquest being a prime example).

    And then let's consider the enjoyment balance, one person was pleased in that clip vs 17 being frustrated by something that they couldn't really do anything about.  And that is a reasonably common occurrence, worse when people are quite reasonably off playing the objective and trying to kill the other infantry contesting them - where you don't have the luxury of being able to stare at the skies in order to deal with one with an LMG.  It simply ruins enjoyment for people, and ruins some maps giving the choice of a) contest flags and win the game but lots of scrubby deaths from that thing, or b) lose the game and lay with a squad with LMGs dealing with them over and over and over again (as they respawn really quickly on the broken mixed servers).  Either way, its boring for the people playing against them.

    My personal opinion is that anyone flying one of those deserves every teabag they get and gets zero respect.  
  • Titan_Awaken
    1193 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Trokey66 said:
    The Murmonts is an abomination that should be in the game.

    Anything that can do this with minimal input from the player is ridiculous.....

    image
    That just proves how trash the coffin bomber is; you get a lot of kills in a short period of time and then you die straight after.

    Like I said, no serious pilot who wants to efficiently farm infantry or top the leaderboard will pick the Muromets for this reason. Players that pick the HB are looking for short term gains that are not sustainable in the long run. 

    An adept attack plane pilot can continuously farm infantry throughout the whole match without a single death. An adept Muromets pilot is lucky to pull off even 2 complete bombing runs before getting downed. 

    WetFishDB said:
    And then let's consider the enjoyment balance, one person was pleased in that clip vs 17 being frustrated by something that they couldn't really do anything about. 
    You can easily avoid dying from a HB by simply running perpendicular or at right angles to the direction it's traveling in. ie) If it's heading straight towards you, run 90 degrees left or right to it. Perform a bayonet charge if you have it equipped. 
  • MarxistDictator
    5179 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Yeah and then avoid dying to the bomber while you are in heavy combat defending a flag and didn’t even notice it spawn in. Then you and all nearby teammates get to die because you weren’t playing watch the sky with 5 AA rockets and a spawn-circling bomber killer fighter. Such balance wow. An attack plane is more like an artillery mortar in that it can only punish players like reviving each other packed up effectively, they are not sitting there pulling constant 10+ strafes or anywhere close. Fighters destroy them easily while 2/3 fighter load outs struggle to kill bombers. Plus it has 2 infantry counters that hinder it to the point just 1 can counter it yet those same weapons are next to meaningless against other planes. I’ve flown the attack plane a ton and unless people just straight up can’t fly on PC there is a lot of danger to going down, particularly from fighters and even worse multiple fighters or AAs. The bomber can succeed despite the danger, which is why a lot of pilots use it even though they will die. Chances are you will die anyway unless you choose the fighter these days which isn’t very entertaining to fly with the limited impact on the ground it has.
  • ElliotLH
    9360 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Never had any love for the heavy bomber myself, so I'll just echo what others have said and suggest the ground attack plane instead. You can be really nasty and aggressive with it on Operations but still avoid dying to AA for the most part.
  • MarxistDictator
    5179 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    And I’ll keep echoing what other pilots in this game say, you can get those kills over a few minutes and still be at risk of getting shot down or you can hop in a heavy bomber and get them in one strafe if you get shot down whatever a plane spawn is barely longer than the time it takes to strafe reload all your bombs and bring it around, and then there are maps with no plane spawn delays or shorter delays where it basically spawns right where it needs to drop bombs.

    It is the worst thing in the game, at least the artillery truck does not commonly get 30 kills in one minute.
  • PappaDraco
    16 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    spot with the machine gun
  • CFPA_Football
    36 postsMember, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member

    I got my tenth kill yesterday with the Ilya in order to get the Codex for it. In order to get it, pretty much every time that I had the option to pilot or gun on an Ilya I spawned into one. This forum thread helped me make the tenth kill after seeing Trokey's video. Namely, I aimed to fly over enemy flags using Third PV, then changed to FPV when I was well set on the path, then switched to Zoom/Scope firing mode as I got close, and then dropped all 5 bombs soon before getting the flag n the middle of the scope, in order to hit any enemies camped in front of their flag.

    I got only one kill this way out of about 5 attempts at flying or gunning on the Ilya yesterday. One time doing this I dropped three bombs when I did not see anyone and I did damage to an unseen enemy. I learned that I should have dropped all 5 bombs because it would have increased the likelihood of making a kill. So on a later attempt I dropped all 5 bombs when I didn't see anyone or saw just one enemy, and that made my final (10th) kill.
  • WetFishDB
    2314 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Trokey66 said:
    The Murmonts is an abomination that should be in the game.

    Anything that can do this with minimal input from the player is ridiculous.....

    image
    That just proves how trash the coffin bomber is; you get a lot of kills in a short period of time and then you die straight after.

    Like I said, no serious pilot who wants to efficiently farm infantry or top the leaderboard will pick the Muromets for this reason. Players that pick the HB are looking for short term gains that are not sustainable in the long run. 

    An adept attack plane pilot can continuously farm infantry throughout the whole match without a single death. An adept Muromets pilot is lucky to pull off even 2 complete bombing runs before getting downed. 

    WetFishDB said:
    And then let's consider the enjoyment balance, one person was pleased in that clip vs 17 being frustrated by something that they couldn't really do anything about. 
    You can easily avoid dying from a HB by simply running perpendicular or at right angles to the direction it's traveling in. ie) If it's heading straight towards you, run 90 degrees left or right to it. Perform a bayonet charge if you have it equipped. 
    Only if you are staring at the skies and not concentrating on killing enemies on objectives.
  • TheGM86
    876 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    *Makes something that is very easy quite difficult for no reason*
    Or you could have just went and played operations and moonscaped a flag for 14 kills on one bombing run.

  • CFPA_Football
    36 postsMember, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member


    AA guns are probably the biggest threat to the heavy bomber as you are flying a big slow moving aircraft that even the most blind team mate can hit. If your heavy bomber comes under fire from a AA position there are only 3 likely out comes.


    1. The AA gunner gets sniped and you get to bomb the objective. Though using a AA gun usually gets you a bullet in the head the enemy have a annoying habit of only doing this after they have shot You down.

    Yes, I kept flying the Ilya bomber over and over across the map on Monte Grappa to do the codex and getting shot down by the AA gun over and over, although sometimes it was enemy planes or going out of bounds that killed my plane. Then it happened twice on the Sinai map yesterday, and I got so annoyed that I switched to Assault, ran to the AA gun from the flank, and then afterwards blew it up with dynamite. So Yes, the AA guns firing at the Ilya can be a real "downer". 

    Ironically, when you unlock the Codex, it says something like: out of 400 sorties flown by the Ilya, only one Ilya was ever downed by enemy aircraft (despite it happening often in the game).

    Of course, I do understand whhy the designers make it vulnerable - it can make alot of kills in the hands of a skilled pilot.
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