No Joystick Support*

Comments

  • CONVEEEN
    172 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    TL;DR the old joystick is not the problem, the old API the game uses, is. (Edit: at least, that's the case for BF3/4. I notice that control binding in general is broken in BF1 right now, so perhaps there is another issue at play here.)

    ok, so other than the op who is using a defunct joystick no longer supported by even microsoft, what joysticks are people trying to use?

    a joypad being used as the controller input image isn't a huge deal, more people are likely to use pads than joysticks in all honesty.

    USB joysticks are a standard HID device. The devs won't need to code for specific joysticks, just for joysticks in general. Kinda like with keyboards for example. The system doesn't care if I have the latest Logitech or an old brand-X I got for $5 in 1990.



    via https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd742873(v=vs.85).aspx
    The joystick services can simultaneously monitor two joysticks,

    Which is not enough, obviously. Fortunately, this API is deprecated:
    The multimedia joystick API has been superseded by DirectInput, which has more capabilities for today's input and force-feedback devices. For more information, see the DirectX documentation.


    Here is the beginning of said doco. I'm sure your devs have an MSDN sub already ;)

    https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ee416842(v=vs.85).aspx

    As you can see in this example, DirectInput allows the selcetion of n devices:

    http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~jparise/directx/joystick/#selecting
    You could store all the enumerated joysticks and let the user pick.

    So, no more 2- joystick limit.


    HTH.

    Very nice explained, thx!!

    Maybe DICE give us the code to do it by communtiy self ;)
  • Fam62UA
    1 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Medal of Honor Warfighter, Battlefield 1 Member
    I Joystick Logitech Extreme 3D does not work .Very sad if the developers did not respond to this problem: ((
  • 88to92E4
    79 postsMember, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    I have a Microsoft Sidewinder 3D Pro, it doesn't work either. Joysticks have worked perfectly for me in BFBC2, BF3 & 4.

    Also, there's a "joystick" tab in the keybindings menu so I hope this is just something that took a backseat in priority.

    The OLD GUARD (the devs that sold out to EA) just sit back in closed office spaces and count their money. The NEW GUARD are all a bunch of console jocks with game pads sitting on their desks. They DO NOT KNOW WHAT A JOYSTICK IS!
  • SirBobdk
    5044 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    I have spend so many hours the last 6 years learning how to fly (with a joystick) and now i can just throw it all in the trash.
    Corresponds to take K+M away from the infantry players and ask them and to use controller.
    And yes, I could learn to play with K + M or controller, but frankly, I don't want to start all over again.
    I will be annoyed every time I start the game and have to learn how to fly AGAIN.
  • StarscreamUK
    7483 postsMember, Moderator, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Moderator
    WXT115 wrote: »
    I have a Microsoft Sidewinder 3D Pro, it doesn't work either. Joysticks have worked perfectly for me in BFBC2, BF3 & 4.

    Also, there's a "joystick" tab in the keybindings menu so I hope this is just something that took a backseat in priority.

    The OLD GUARD (the devs that sold out to EA) just sit back in closed office spaces and count their money. The NEW GUARD are all a bunch of console jocks with game pads sitting on their desks. They DO NOT KNOW WHAT A JOYSTICK IS!

    If you cannot contribute to a discussion constructively then don't bother posting at all.
  • SirBobdk
    5044 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited October 2016
    If you cannot contribute to a discussion constructively then don't bother posting at all.
    Agree
    I understand the frustration, but we need support to argue why joystick should remain a part of the PC.
    Even from players who may not use joystick.
    we play on PC and every time a nye game comes out we loose functions because new games have focus on console players.
    Post edited by SirBobdk on
  • SenBotsu893
    4 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield Member
    same issue here. i whish i could fly with my joystick but what do i get in the option menu: 360 controller setup.
    wtf??? i have never ever even used a 360 controller.
    why would i even want to use a controller on my pc? if i really wanted to play with a controller i would play on a console.

    there has to be a way to make the joystick work. some 3rd party tools maybe?
  • Kuiriel
    18 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    It's nice to see other people jump in and say this is important. Even a grumpy voice in solidarity is better than no voice at all (though really, it's a waste for anyone to throw insults at EA/DICE - just vote with your wallet, refund the game if it's important enough to you or don't pre-order, same as the rest of us being left out).
  • Who_is_El_KaBong
    32 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    ugh. guess i didnt make the right choice by purchasing a flight stick before release... oh well, theres always star citizen.
  • SirBobdk
    5044 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    ugh. guess i didnt make the right choice by purchasing a flight stick before release... oh well, theres always star citizen.
    We can still hope :smile:
    Silence = accepting
  • CONVEEEN
    172 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    @DICE/EA https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joystick
    "The first 2-axis joystick was probably invented around 1944 in ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Germany. The device was developed for targeting the glide bomb Henschel Hs 293 against ship targets. Here, the joystick was used by an operator to steer the missile towards its target by radio control. This joystick had on-off switches rather than analogue sensors.

    Ahhh maybe because is a WW1 game? :D

    Anyway we keep this thread goes alive until there give us what is normal for a PC game!

    @all also click this link and click "me too" to write EA answers.ea.com/t5/Technical-Issues/No-Joystick-Support-for-Planes-on-Early-Access/td-p/5621280
  • xcasxcursex
    1676 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited October 2016
    there has to be a way to make the joystick work. some 3rd party tools maybe?

    There are tools which help, but they have serious drawbacks ranging from regularly reconfiguring themselves (UJR) to getting you banned for appearing as though you are hacking (x360ce). Not to mention, that they run in user space, which means they cannot be relied upon to provide accurately timed input (read: they might be laggy at times)
    -
    We, as end-users, can do only so much poking around and guesswork here. The only real solution is for DICE to code the game to work with a modern setup that includes multiple input devices of varying design.
    -
    For all we know, they already have. Even the mouse and keyboard aren't working in game right now (see various posts regarding mouse wheel being hardcoded and keybindings being overridden/ignored), it would not surprise me if the joystick gets fixed when that does. Honestly, it would also not surprise me if the joysticks never work. We should wait and see, before we get mad. (Not looking at anyone in particular) (Looks at WXT115) (Looks in mirror) ;)
    -
    -
    -
    WRT my earlier post regarding the API in use - I've done a little homework on this. Full disclosure - the last time I wrote an app which used a joystick was over a decade ago. I have a LOT of catching up to do. This does, however, serve to demonstrate just how out-of-date the joystick support in the old games is. The API that BF3/4 appears to have used (again - this is just guesswork. I don't have access to the game source code, obviously), was deprecated in 1995. As it turns out, DirectInput was also deprecated, in 2005.
    -
    However, the game also uses a newer API called XInput (GG for using a name that's already taken, Microsoft. SMH) to support the xbox controllers (I'm 100% on this bit of guesswork - this is why x360ce works). The same API can also be used to support other joysticks - although, it still has a limit of 4 devices (since it's ported from the xbox, MS PLS!), which isn't many when you think about it. A racing wheel, a flight stick with separate throttle, an xbox controller, and you're maxxed out. Many serious PC gamers will pass that limit.
    -
    The reason that I mention this, aside from to correct my previous post a little, is that either way, our USB joysticks are exposed as a HID. Documentation is here: https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/hh405052(v=vs.85).aspx
    -
    The point being, whichever API the game is using, even cruddy old USB joysticks not supported by Microsoft, are just as workable as the latest X52 or Warthog HOTAS or Xbox controller. The system sees them all the same way. They're using the same driver (as confirmed here using an X1 elite controller and an old Logitech and a virtual device).
    -
    This suggests that the game already supports the required APIs and needs to be coded to handle the other (non-xbox) devices. It's kinda behaving like an xbox game at present. INB4 someone says "console port", xbox is windows these days, so yeh.....

    Edit: Fixed URL and line breaks



    Post edited by xcasxcursex on
  • SirBobdk
    5044 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    @CaptaPraelium wrote:
    it would not surprise me if the joystick gets fixed when that does

    Gj. Lets hope for this.

    I gave the early access a try 2n8. (no cheaters :smile: )
    Have to say, I'm not impressed with the maps.
    As in the beta, I quickly got bored playing only infantry.
    So if I gonna play this game, EA must find a solution for joystick.
  • rainkloud
    548 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Has anyone tried Joy2key? I saw another forum poster mention it but they didn't say whether it gave them analog control (gradual movement) or binary (on/off).
  • SirBobdk
    5044 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited October 2016
    rainkloud wrote: »
    Has anyone tried Joy2key? I saw another forum poster mention it but they didn't say whether it gave them analog control (gradual movement) or binary (on/off).
    They tried it in the beta and it didn't work, but thanks for input, it is appreciated.
  • Kuiriel
    18 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Capta Praelium, you should really post that awesome relevant info in the Answers forum too. http://answers.ea.com/t5/Technical-Issues/No-Joystick-Support-for-Planes-on-Early-Access/td-p/5621280/page/2
  • SirBobdk
    5044 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Kuiriel wrote: »
    Capta Praelium, you should really post that awesome relevant info in the Answers forum too. http://answers.ea.com/t5/Technical-Issues/No-Joystick-Support-for-Planes-on-Early-Access/td-p/5621280/page/2

    Agree, our über joystick supporter :smiley:
  • CONVEEEN
    172 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    I got a present for DICE Developer Team, I will wait a bit for sending them these :)

    27141074pq.jpg




  • xcasxcursex
    1676 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Thanks guys I appreciate it. Please don't mistake me for the expert on the subject, I'm just a rusty old dev trying to lend a hand and clarify the nature of the issue. Dice's devs are on a whole other level to me and will definitely know what's wrong and how to fix it. We just have to get their managers, to tell them to do it ;)
  • SirBobdk
    5044 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    @CaptaPraelium wrote:
    I'm just a rusty old dev
    Welcome to the club :smile:
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