Hit Detection

Comments

  • strombergs04
    123 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    I know what you mean but I am having this Issue in fully broken Buildings. I can stand in the MIDDLE of a fully broken house (no walls at all left) and itll do that.
  • VBALL_MVP
    6177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited January 2017
    I believe EA/Dice use Microsoft Azure to host their virtual servers.

    Azure regions North Europe, West Europe, UK West, UK South
    ExpressRoute locations Amsterdam, Dublin, London, Newport(Wales), Paris

    So it would be easy to region lock as the servers should be in ideal locations, but it seems if the server browser is correct they only use Dublin for Europe matchmaking. Put some servers in Amsterdam and Paris then ping lock or region lock jobs a good'un not that hard really.

    No German region for servers this would be I imagine due to privacy laws in Germany

    Regions and geopolitical boundaries for national clouds
    Germany Germany Central, Germany East Berlin, Frankfurt

    Connectivity across geopolitical regions is not supported on the standard ExpressRoute SKU. You will need to enable the ExpressRoute premium add-on to support global connectivity. Connectivity to national cloud environments is not supported. You can work with your connectivity provider if such a need arises.

    Would someone from Dice confirm this or am I talking a load of BS?

    From my ping tracing tests they are not in the same location as Azure, so I don't think they are using it.
    mischkag wrote: »
    The fact that the game simply runs too well for high pingers, encourages players to join explicitly out of region. Next on my list is to address that. I will make it much harder to hit something for high pingers, i wont artificially induce Rubberbanding or movement hurdles though. I think it should be harder to hit somebody, that is what the game ultimately boils down to. Seeing your strong feedback encourages me to explore options to make it much harder for high ping players. Once they feel like they suck with higher ping, the problem will solve itself. I still like to push the necessity to region lock servers. It is an ongoing discussion and I personally believe it is getting traction.

    Holy wall of text batman. :wink:

    I can understand why movement hurdles and induced rubber banding are not things you want to implement (would probably feel terrible).

    Are you considering something similar to bf4? High ping have to lead shots more than normal? (That didn't feel too awful, it was learn-able compromise)
    mischkag wrote: »
    As far as the character model comment above goes, i dont quite understand that. There is no desync. How do you know what the high ping client is actually doing? Plz dont judge from the spectator view which is artificially put behind by 500ms.

    I'm not viewing from spectator (I understand the offset), the reason I assume there is an issue with desync, is I have been killed multiple times by players appearing around a corner (like multiple steps instantly) and dying from that player immediately, like one frame per bullet. (This could be an issue with the high frequency bubble (I think I brought that up already), it has a similar visual pop in to other issues I've seen with friendly players in my high frequency bubble).

    I know I can abuse the peakers advantage myself with latency over ~200ms, I have been assuming the irregularity I see from dying in these situations is the receiving end of the peaking advantage. I'll be the first to admit this is purely an assumption.

    It just doesn't feel right, maybe it's something completely different. I know I've recorded it happening, I'll make sure to highlight the problem I see in video form.

    I trust you will do what you can to fix the issues with players delivering damage ahead of their visible player model. Sounds like netcode things are moving in a very positive direction.

    There still can be other issues that can be causing you to have people appear around the corner or dying immediately. Things like your side having network issues, or the wonderful bad spawn feature. As for the instant deaths, it could be again network issues on your side like jitter or packetloss. The other thing which I have noticed it could be you took damage from multiple players at the same time. One way to determine this is do something like what CSGO does and show in the kill feed (top right corner) all the names of the names of players that contributed in your death (in a given time frame say 500ms).

    Edit: As you probably have seen on twitter to your post, it looks to be a bug.
  • KingTolapsium
    5491 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    edited January 2017
    @VBALL_MVP

    I understand, the problem with a guy appearing then instantly delivering damage could be network related, but I don't see any variance outside of the normal bounds (~3ms variance), and from the times I've seen it, it appeared to be a single player doing the damage, and it appears to be tied to specific enemy players.

    It is winter, and my lines do run above ground for a short stretch, it's not out of the question that it's network related, but I haven't noticed any specific network issues coinciding with the deaths, and it's never a situation where all deaths feel this way.

    I think i've only recorded two clear instances, but I've seen similar things quite a bit, many of these other instances weren't recorded because there is no clear proof of an issue, it just looks and feels off when one player always has the jump on you and he shows visible lag that his fellow soldiers do not, this visible lag is not always there, just in most instances.

    I agree having a small "hit feed" upon death would be a magnificent addition, I wonder if it would negatively impact performance though, could at least clear up part of my complaint.

  • VBALL_MVP
    6177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    @VBALL_MVP

    I understand, the problem with a guy appearing then instantly delivering damage could be network related, but I don't see any variance outside of the normal bounds (~3ms variance), and from the times I've seen it, it appeared to be a single player doing the damage, and it appears to be tied to specific enemy players.

    It is winter, and my lines do run above ground for a short stretch, it's not out of the question that it's network related, but I haven't noticed any specific network issues coinciding with the deaths, and it's never a situation where all deaths feel this way.

    I think i've only recorded two clear instances, but I've seen similar things quite a bit, many of these other instances weren't recorded because there is no clear proof of an issue, it just looks and feels off when one player always has the jump on you and he shows visible lag that his fellow soldiers do not, this visible lag is not always there, just in most instances.

    I agree having a small "hit feed" upon death would be a magnificent addition, I wonder if it would negatively impact performance though, could at least clear up part of my complaint.

    I doubt if it would impact performance, I mean it's kinda doing it already when it gives someone an "Assist counts as kill".

    I don't know, I hear what you are saying but working for ISPs in the past you learn about some shady stuff they do.

    Look, in the end I have as many questions as you do. I guess my mindset is that there are still many bugs in the game, and many inconsistencies. Until they resolve that its hard to say anything else can be the cause.
  • KingTolapsium
    5491 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    @VBALL_MVP

    I understand, the problem with a guy appearing then instantly delivering damage could be network related, but I don't see any variance outside of the normal bounds (~3ms variance), and from the times I've seen it, it appeared to be a single player doing the damage, and it appears to be tied to specific enemy players.

    It is winter, and my lines do run above ground for a short stretch, it's not out of the question that it's network related, but I haven't noticed any specific network issues coinciding with the deaths, and it's never a situation where all deaths feel this way.

    I think i've only recorded two clear instances, but I've seen similar things quite a bit, many of these other instances weren't recorded because there is no clear proof of an issue, it just looks and feels off when one player always has the jump on you and he shows visible lag that his fellow soldiers do not, this visible lag is not always there, just in most instances.

    I agree having a small "hit feed" upon death would be a magnificent addition, I wonder if it would negatively impact performance though, could at least clear up part of my complaint.

    I doubt if it would impact performance, I mean it's kinda doing it already when it gives someone an "Assist counts as kill".

    I don't know, I hear what you are saying but working for ISPs in the past you learn about some shady stuff they do.

    Look, in the end I have as many questions as you do. I guess my mindset is that there are still many bugs in the game, and many inconsistencies. Until they resolve that its hard to say anything else can be the cause.

    I hear ya. That's why I'm trying to explain my issue as completely as I can, it could be any number of things causing this.

    In the end, as long as these issues get addressed, I wouldn't care what that meant from a hardware/software perspective.

    I can't help but throw in my own guess. :)
  • lizzard
    985 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited January 2017
    Im going to share some funny captures of inconsistent moments whit you guys.

    Ps4
    Europe servers.
    30ms ping.
    No package loss.


    Excuse some bad aiming. And the fact that I suck really hard at using the horse..

    First hits on suport guy is harcore. No hitmarkers. Also when fireing from second floor at enemy's chest. Is hardcore.



    In this video. There is some of these A10 hunter inconsistencies.




    Cheers for reading and writing on the forum @mischkag
  • SupremeEpidemic
    412 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited January 2017
    @lizzard

    Good captures....
  • lizzard
    985 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    @lizzard

    Good captures....

    Thanks man. Hope it brings some laughing.
  • RichardPye843
    206 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    I deal with that type of stuff in the videos EVERY time I play BF1 some days worst than others. Some matches worst than others. Some to even a worst extent. My favorite is when I shot a guy dead center with a shot gun shell tank round in the back 3 m away and only did 68 damage. Plus spawning in tanks and the entire tank repair function is missing and does not work. Also the worst is the ricochets from tanks. Hitting them broad side dead center and get the 2 pts damage ricochet. I have had light tanks all of a sudden teleport behind me. All I wish I had recorded. Spotting not working unless you spot planes or vehicles. Infantry does not work at all sometimes.
  • SupremeEpidemic
    412 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    lizzard wrote: »
    @lizzard

    Good captures....

    Thanks man. Hope it brings some laughing.

    Well I mean for evidence that there is real issues.
  • Cactus757
    47 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    @mischkag

    I hope you watch the clips Lizzard posted. That is also what I see way too often when playing with 20ms ping. I move OOR to 150ms and that stuff almost never happens. I think your idea of making things harder to hit for high pingers is a bad idea. It does nothing to solve the obvious hit detection problems shown in the videos. Then you'll have a game that plays poorly for low and high pings. The biggest problem is too large a ping variance is allowed. Until you're willing to accept that fact, most fixes are band-**** at best. Limiting the ping on a handful of servers doesn't disenfranchise anyone. Everyone still has access to servers. Most people would be happy then. Your proposed change would only result in more unhappy players. I don't understand why this isn't being seriously considered. I don't buy the T&C excuse. Everyone can still play. You could even call them Test Servers.
  • KingTolapsium
    5491 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    My turn, I have more incidental issues recorded, but these feel game breaking.



    Here's that damage before player model bug. I'd recorded it before the patch as well, but I don't want to report issues from previous builds.
  • oJU5T1No
    901 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    1:45 thats what I get nearly all the time and what I was trying to describe in the last posts the character model being out of sync with the damage being dealt.
  • lizzard
    985 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited January 2017
    My turn, I have more incidental issues recorded, but these feel game breaking.



    Here's that damage before player model bug. I'd recorded it before the patch as well, but I don't want to report issues from previous builds.

    Nice clips indeed!

    Those killed before you see playermodel moments. I bet thats a guy with a ping that goes crazy high and low.
    Results in that you get killed like 1-3 second before you see him coming around a corner.

    If its not connection related.. (you know there are som guys saying ping doesn't have any negative impact on the gameplay or the servers) then There is something really broken in the game or the servers.

    I wish we could have the netgraph on the bottom of the screen. On a line, whit out the graph part. That way it would not be so invasive on the gameplay. And it would be easier to have the graph on.


    Im going to see if I can link a guy in to this thread. I have seen unedited gameplay from him. While having +900ms ping. And the server doesn't reject his bullets. The enemies die like they should. And he doesn't get killed by a ohk a single time!
    I wish he will post that gameplay in this thread.

    @xaxoni maybe you have some clips?
  • VBALL_MVP
    6177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    lizzard wrote: »
    My turn, I have more incidental issues recorded, but these feel game breaking.



    Here's that damage before player model bug. I'd recorded it before the patch as well, but I don't want to report issues from previous builds.

    Nice clips indeed!

    Those killed before you see playermodel moments. I bet thats a guy with a ping that goes crazy high and low.
    Results in that you get killed like 1-3 second before you see him coming around a corner.

    If its not connection related.. (you know there are som guys saying ping doesn't have any negative impact on the gameplay or the servers) then There is something really broken in the game or the servers.

    I wish we could have the netgraph on the bottom of the screen. On a line, whit out the graph part. That way it would not be so invasive on the gameplay. And it would be easier to have the graph on.


    Im going to see if I can link a guy in to this thread. I have seen unedited gameplay from him. While having +900ms ping. And the server doesn't reject his bullets. The enemies die like they should. And he doesn't get killed by a ohk a single time!
    I wish he will post that gameplay in this thread.

    @xaxoni maybe you have some clips?

    Guess you are referring to me. Well why does it have to be connection related? Why can't it be poor coding and bugs like the other fixes (aka melee bug, or dissappearin hitboxes when vaulting)?

    @KingTolapsium do you know what the extra offeet value means? What effects it to go high or low? It's one of the values I really don't know on the netgraph.

    Also last clip, looks like that awful spawn system where you can spawn on a guy being shot at or dead. What was interesting also is your latency went through the roof when you got revived.
  • CosmicStriker
    748 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    the Hit Detection is actually good in this game, as compared to games like World of Tanks that has horrible detection, thanks to their bad netcode.
    Dice has really worked out their netcode bugs since the BF4 days.
    so if you are having problems it's going to be attribute to network lag times.
  • SupremeEpidemic
    412 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    My turn, I have more incidental issues recorded, but these feel game breaking.



    Here's that damage before player model bug. I'd recorded it before the patch as well, but I don't want to report issues from previous builds.

    I notice you have a little bit of packet loss from the look of your netgraph. That is beside the point, because I too experience similar issues to what your encountering in your videos, and I have ABSOLUTELY no packet loss when i connect to NA East servers. I posted a still screenshot of my netgraph a few pages back-in this thread of course(which that really doesnt matter either)
  • lizzard
    985 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    lizzard wrote: »
    My turn, I have more incidental issues recorded, but these feel game breaking.



    Here's that damage before player model bug. I'd recorded it before the patch as well, but I don't want to report issues from previous builds.

    Nice clips indeed!

    Those killed before you see playermodel moments. I bet thats a guy with a ping that goes crazy high and low.
    Results in that you get killed like 1-3 second before you see him coming around a corner.

    If its not connection related.. (you know there are som guys saying ping doesn't have any negative impact on the gameplay or the servers) then There is something really broken in the game or the servers.

    I wish we could have the netgraph on the bottom of the screen. On a line, whit out the graph part. That way it would not be so invasive on the gameplay. And it would be easier to have the graph on.


    Im going to see if I can link a guy in to this thread. I have seen unedited gameplay from him. While having +900ms ping. And the server doesn't reject his bullets. The enemies die like they should. And he doesn't get killed by a ohk a single time!
    I wish he will post that gameplay in this thread.

    @xaxoni maybe you have some clips?

    Guess you are referring to me. Well why does it have to be connection related? Why can't it be poor coding and bugs like the other fixes (aka melee bug, or dissappearin hitboxes when vaulting)?

    @KingTolapsium do you know what the extra offeet value means? What effects it to go high or low? It's one of the values I really don't know on the netgraph.

    Also last clip, looks like that awful spawn system where you can spawn on a guy being shot at or dead. What was interesting also is your latency went through the roof when you got revived.

    I wasn't referring to anyone specific..

    The melee is not fixed.
    Hitboxes is not fixed completely. Yes its better than in bfbc2.

    I also believe that the last death may be one of those incredibly bad spawns.

    Its often the server makes package loss and ping, spike like crazy when revived.. Not sure why? Also the server Extr will spike when you die..

    Offset is the added delay. Or buffer. If I have understood it right..
  • KingTolapsium
    5491 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    edited January 2017
    @VBALL_MVP

    Extrapolation offset relates to network variance. Instead of showing a guess of where a person was/is during moments of mistimed/missing packets, the offset allows the server will hold onto their packet data longer to accurately show their location, making player movement smooth. The offset getting too high (which is only supposed to happen when your network is highly variable(?)) can stop the client from moving freely, I think it delays hit reg too? Idk.

    It's odd, I'm not sure I really understand it all that well, but I know it feels like weak rubber banding when above 40ish, and makes mantling a nightmare, worse and worse the higher it goes.

    That extr offset bug would make the game feel absolutely broken to anyone and could easily be confused with server performance tanking without the netgraph.

    In regard to the clip, there is a lot of issue with latency spiking when going into the menus/coming back to life.

    Watch for it, happens all the time to me, click options, boom latency spike, most of the latency spiking I see on my netgraph is a bug in bf1.
  • jdbelcher1998
    587 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Was just in a game of 40-person Operations and the Extr Offset hit something like 137! It was like playing with severe input lag on your mouse (if you know what that's like), only I'm on PS4 so it affected responsiveness of my character on controller. Rubber banding enemies, getting shot behind cover, collecting damage even. Really bad this afternoon.
Sign In or Register to comment.