Weekly Debrief

Hit Detection

Comments

  • lizzard
    985 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited September 2017
    lizzard wrote: »
    Your efforts in explaining the mechanics of these things. Are remarkable.

    Wish you had the same knowledge of the r6 netcode, as the frostbite engine.

    Me and some friends have found very interesting things in that game.

    Playing as a squad where everyone have +300ms ping. Should be a horrible experience!
    Still its the complete opposite.. 20 played games at +300ms ping against 40-60ms players. = 20 winns and a kd of 5/0-10/0!

    High ping and packet loss. Have to be the most devastating things that can happen to an online game.

    Its mind-boggling that Sony and Microsoft doesn't have any form of regulation of the players connection quality!?

    It destroyes the performance of the games sold on their platforms. And its devastating for the gameplay experience!

    People shouldn't have to exploit flaws in the game, to have a somewhat decent experience!

    I'm working on some images to help explain hit registration and the difference between hitscan and projectile. Plus a few to explain tick rates and what they really mean.

    But for a quick reply, Hitscan and low server->client tick rates give the majority of FPS games that solid hit reg feel. Hitscan plays a major role.

    Sounds good!

    Its amazing how a game that is nearly unplayable at 30-60ms on ps4. Sudenly become really enjoyable at 300ms!

    It even makes the French and Portuguese players killable! Although they still move in 1 meter steps like a slideshow..

    And according to r6s developers. Ping abuse / abusing how the server handles bad connections. Isnt considered cheating!
    And this is in one of the biggest competitive games available on three platforms!

    This makes me believe that online games on console, is a lost cause.. We will never get the experience we think we pay for.

    Yes im sad and sceptical.. I hate it.. But it is what it is..
  • HillbillyJohn
    493 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    denjoga wrote: »
    oJU5T1No wrote: »
    The main issues the aim desist and held by damage are difficult to prove without showing controller inputs side by side, stacked damage is aswell without a 360 view to prove theres only 1 guy shooting you. The debunk squad would be all over it.

    I did capture being killed by an invisible player, the invisible players have made a come back with the recent patch. http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/oJU5T1No/video/36626767

    Without the net graph and a detailed report on your internet route quality, you can't blame the game. It's probably due to your own bloated nodes and hops.

    Just kidding! lol
    Enjoy it while it lasts.

    I just saw the post and not your name and it scared me for a sec!

    Is it just me or is the game play getting worse with each patch?
  • rock1obsta
    3811 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    denjoga wrote: »
    oJU5T1No wrote: »
    The main issues the aim desist and held by damage are difficult to prove without showing controller inputs side by side, stacked damage is aswell without a 360 view to prove theres only 1 guy shooting you. The debunk squad would be all over it.

    I did capture being killed by an invisible player, the invisible players have made a come back with the recent patch. http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/oJU5T1No/video/36626767

    Without the net graph and a detailed report on your internet route quality, you can't blame the game. It's probably due to your own bloated nodes and hops.

    Just kidding! lol
    Enjoy it while it lasts.

    I just saw the post and not your name and it scared me for a sec!

    Is it just me or is the game play getting worse with each patch?

    Not just you. Lots of folks on the forums
  • misisipiRivrRat
    853 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    denjoga wrote: »
    oJU5T1No wrote: »
    The main issues the aim desist and held by damage are difficult to prove without showing controller inputs side by side, stacked damage is aswell without a 360 view to prove theres only 1 guy shooting you. The debunk squad would be all over it.

    I did capture being killed by an invisible player, the invisible players have made a come back with the recent patch. http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/oJU5T1No/video/36626767

    Without the net graph and a detailed report on your internet route quality, you can't blame the game. It's probably due to your own bloated nodes and hops.

    Just kidding! lol
    Enjoy it while it lasts.

    I just saw the post and not your name and it scared me for a sec!

    Is it just me or is the game play getting worse with each patch?

    Worse!
  • UrinDenialP
    144 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    played a bit yesterday
    saturday tried to play twice and quit quite quickly quit....difference was like chalk n cheese.

    netgraphs no different...zero packet loss...but we know that one lol

    pingplotter...routes changing on udp more on saturday....bit of raised ping isp side....normaly between 4-10ms on the first node but this one was spiking to 100ms.

    thats the only difference.

    ive been observing this for 2 months.
    old isp was a lot worse.

    yesterday was enjoyable.

    go figure.
  • rock1obsta
    3811 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    denjoga wrote: »
    Is it just me or is the game play getting worse with each patch?
    After BF3 & 4, it would surprise me if it didn't get worse with each patch.
    Even BF4, which launched in such a shameful state, managed to break more things as they attempted to fix all the broken things.
    Seriously, DICE have proven time and time again that they just are not good at what they do.
    Well... I suppose to be fair, they are good at some aspects - graphics and sound design are always impressive - but putting everything together into a reliably and properly functioning finished product seems to be their weakest link, and that's really kinda the only one that counts.

    I'm always stunned with each new game and every UI update what a consistent mess their UI always is.
    Just look at the patchwork of how you track similar but separately implemented achievement/assignment type things...

    Medals are viewed and tracked one way, ribbons another, specializations yet another, weapon unlocks, community missions, etc., etc.
    Each one is really the same kind of thing - a multistep assignment with a goal - yet the methods of tracking and progressions changes with each one.

    And each implementation is a slight improvement over the one before but the improvements never get applied retroactively and each new implementation always includes at least one glaring shortcoming that makes you say, "why did they do that???"

    E.g. - medals are just a mess; choice of 5 at random, choices and progress reset weekly, steps that have to be done separately and in an order that many times defies logic, but at least you can fairly easily view the 5 active ones from anywhere in the game or main menu - however, can anyone tell me how to view the numerical value of your progress anywhere, at any time other than via the circle w/ number that appears for a second or two after you achieve an increment?!?!

    Specializations goes back to the much more logical model of BF4 medals - all active at all times, work on any element any time you choose either actively or passively, pick one to track - but to access anything but the chosen tracked element from within the game is convoluted and confusing.

    Community missions - viewable only in the main menu; assigns a fairly high number of things to achieve, so that it's guaranteed to take more than one match; however, no way to view progress without exiting the server back to the main menu - no small ordeal itself.
    Leaves me trying to manually count resupplies/lmg kills/whatever in my head so I can try to have some kind of guess as to when I might've completed it without having to leave the server.

    [EPIC FACEPALM]

    I could go on and on and on with the little UI/UX elements that either make no sense or are just plain broken.

    But hey - at least they got rid of those little orange indicators in BF3&4 that showed you when you had unlocked some new item - and then either never went away or just kept reappearing...
    Oh my god, those things drove me insane!
    And the fact that they carried that issue over from one generation to the next (did BF:H have it too?) - that was just like pouring salt on a wound.

    /rant

    Very well said.
  • kniphtee
    244 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Not saying it's hit reg but the game feels buggy like it needs overhauled and streamlined.
  • trig0tron
    324 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    rock1obsta wrote: »
    oJU5T1No wrote: »
    The players with the spiking pings are by far the worst and cause the most issues, but its possible to have lower level packet loss (yellow packet loss icon) and still have a low stable ping displayed on the scoreboard i've tested it, i've also experienced being held by damage and stacked damage from what on the scoreboards appears to be a low latency player I don't know how much packet loss it takes before your ping starts spiking in the scoreboard but I suspect its quite a high amount.
    Also playing with minor packet loss the game just plays so much better, hit detection is near perfect no more aim desist and the game just seems so much better in sync.

    Yeah as I mentioned. "30ms avg spiking to 110ms".

    FYI console ping only updates every 5 seconds from what I recall. PC updates once a second.
    Basically, gameplay is **** because game accepts ****.

    If they kicked for garbage connections then it would be fine. The best direction at the moment would be to provide better tools to the rsp. Ping kicker was a start. But we need something that's more robust...jitter/variance/packet loss kicking. Having lower options for the rsp would be nice too.

    I mean, yeah.

    But RSP still avoids quickmatch. There is no fixing this while the public is steered away from custom (and possibly superior) experiences.

    I've given up on DICE making meaningful changes, most of the devs are apologists. (Most, not all, obviously the devs that truly understand and listen are in the minority).

    It's disheartening to voice concerns, only to be told your concerns are not a problem. Just a bunch of 40 year Olds playing Pokémon go, no way things are going to get better.

    Damn. You used to be so optimistic about changes coming to the game. I'm sorry you feel like this. Sadly more and more people see the game in this light. The BS in game just gets so old.

    Sadly, I don't think EA or DICE is ever gonna change anything until even the most loyal fans turn their back.
    They need to worry about the majority first. The biggest customer base.
    Only after the majority is satisfied should they even consider the rest.

    This ridiculous notion that they can please everyone is an impossibility.
    In case they haven't noticed, their stupid insistence on such a monumental failure is causing people to leave.

    The only acceptable answer is to let everyone's experience rely solely on their own connection.
    I mean, who the hell ever even thought their way of doing this was a good idea?

    It needs to be scrapped and redone so that the majority of the playerbase can play without these problems.

    Then they can put servers in places that don't have enough (by marketing the game in places where they knew there weren't any servers they showed how greed can destroy a company's reputation)

    My hopes are that they get a healthy dose of reality when they push their idea of comp play onto the public.

    Incursions on PC will be running 120Hz server. That's an 8.33ms tick interval. At that rate a 50ms connection plays like 100ms on pub 60Hz.

    Sirland did state on twitter there will be more server locations for Incursions. We'll see.

    If incursions falls on its face there will be one hell of a shockwave rippling through DICE HQ.



    Incursions is plagued with hackstars, no meaningful gameplay, or testing can be done.
    Are the current alpha servers 120Hz..?
  • Rev0verDrive
    6756 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    trig0tron wrote:
    Incursions is plagued with hackstars, no meaningful gameplay, or testing can be done.
    Are the current alpha servers 120Hz..?

    Yes, All Servers are 120Hz.
  • Rev0verDrive
    6756 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    kniphtee wrote:
    Not saying it's hit reg but the game feels buggy like it needs overhauled and streamlined.

    Server performance issue. Another patch inbound on the 29th with more tweaks.
  • kniphtee
    244 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    kniphtee wrote:
    Not saying it's hit reg but the game feels buggy like it needs overhauled and streamlined.

    Server performance issue. Another patch inbound on the 29th with more tweaks.

    I've played round after round over the last...bit and have been defensively saying it has to be something else - well other than bad from game to game, that is to say one game it's snappy and happy with the next round and you're dumping at close range 9 shots from some smg and it does 12 dmg - so without being a doctor i'll just say i'm patient...grr.

    As a side note, why did DICE ask for thoughts on the service assignments and then not bother to alter them? Or make changes to the beta maps when we offered suggestion - they just pumped them out? Or have these forums/reddits/twatter thingy's and then not change anything? For seeming to be more in touch with the community they seem more obstinate to do whatever they so choose and then pat on the head those who sell their gear - I am not pleased. We have all these PTFO skins and so many of the assignments or whatever have nothing to do with PTFO'ing - I hate bringing myself down to just doing it to do it...it seems so 20's-drinking-college-mistakes-were-made-age...

    I have hopes for the patch but will be more skeptical - thank you much for the info.
  • Rev0verDrive
    6756 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    kniphtee wrote:
    I've played round after round over the last...bit and have been defensively saying it has to be something else - well other than bad from game to game, that is to say one game it's snappy and happy with the next round and you're dumping at close range 9 shots from some smg and it does 12 dmg - so without being a doctor i'll just say i'm patient...grr.

    As a side note, why did DICE ask for thoughts on the service assignments and then not bother to alter them? Or make changes to the beta maps when we offered suggestion - they just pumped them out? Or have these forums/reddits/twatter thingy's and then not change anything? For seeming to be more in touch with the community they seem more obstinate to do whatever they so choose and then pat on the head those who sell their gear - I am not pleased. We have all these PTFO skins and so many of the assignments or whatever have nothing to do with PTFO'ing - I hate bringing myself down to just doing it to do it...it seems so 20's-drinking-college-mistakes-were-made-age...

    I have hopes for the patch but will be more skeptical - thank you much for the info.

    Who really knows what happens in the studio? For all I know they could be running UX on the ideas internally. Some ideas just flat out don't belong or don't work. They may have made decisions, but are locked in on other issues/systems (server performance issue). I do know Incursions is definitely the priority. EA is pushing it hard. Server performance has to be top notch for it to even matter. And those issues have to be hit before any, if any, incursions based RSP changes are integrated.
  • digga11
    769 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    denjoga wrote: »
    Is it just me or is the game play getting worse with each patch?
    After BF3 & 4, it would surprise me if it didn't get worse with each patch.
    Even BF4, which launched in such a shameful state, managed to break more things as they attempted to fix all the broken things.
    Seriously, DICE have proven time and time again that they just are not good at what they do.
    Well... I suppose to be fair, they are good at some aspects - graphics and sound design are always impressive - but putting everything together into a reliably and properly functioning finished product seems to be their weakest link, and that's really kinda the only one that counts.

    I'm always stunned with each new game and every UI update what a consistent mess their UI always is.
    Just look at the patchwork of how you track similar but separately implemented achievement/assignment type things...

    Medals are viewed and tracked one way, ribbons another, specializations yet another, weapon unlocks, community missions, etc., etc.
    Each one is really the same kind of thing - a multistep assignment with a goal - yet the methods of tracking and progressions changes with each one.

    And each implementation is a slight improvement over the one before but the improvements never get applied retroactively and each new implementation always includes at least one glaring shortcoming that makes you say, "why did they do that???"

    E.g. - medals are just a mess; choice of 5 at random, choices and progress reset weekly, steps that have to be done separately and in an order that many times defies logic, but at least you can fairly easily view the 5 active ones from anywhere in the game or main menu - however, can anyone tell me how to view the numerical value of your progress anywhere, at any time other than via the circle w/ number that appears for a second or two after you achieve an increment?!?!

    Specializations goes back to the much more logical model of BF4 medals - all active at all times, work on any element any time you choose either actively or passively, pick one to track - but to access anything but the chosen tracked element from within the game is convoluted and confusing.

    Community missions - viewable only in the main menu; assigns a fairly high number of things to achieve, so that it's guaranteed to take more than one match; however, no way to view progress without exiting the server back to the main menu - no small ordeal itself.
    Leaves me trying to manually count resupplies/lmg kills/whatever in my head so I can try to have some kind of guess as to when I might've completed it without having to leave the server.

    [EPIC FACEPALM]

    I could go on and on and on with the little UI/UX elements that either make no sense or are just plain broken.

    But hey - at least they got rid of those little orange indicators in BF3&4 that showed you when you had unlocked some new item - and then either never went away or just kept reappearing...
    Oh my god, those things drove me insane!
    And the fact that they carried that issue over from one generation to the next (did BF:H have it too?) - that was just like pouring salt on a wound.

    /rant

    When they say it’s the frostbite engine I get the impression that they have lost the keys or they can’t open the bonnet some how.
  • poderoso809
    12 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    that may be a bug my friend that should be fix
  • poderoso809
    12 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    What is your favorite class
  • der_Metatron
    43 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    The new sh#t is 999 ping unenjoyable.....bybye dice have fun with the casual crapfest. Next to nothing has changed. No Ping locked servers, no real hit detection change. Only more damage to guns an faster kills. Seems all good devs at dice work on the lootbboxes in BFRont2 to press the most money out of the players
  • mmarkweII
    2919 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    .....as stated in another thread. ..... a relevant video is always worth more than exaggerated duplicate posts.
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