scout class is being devastated

Comments

  • The_BERG_366
    2604 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    They should have a 6 player cap maximum on a 32-team and be made to carry some sort of spotting aid as a gadget.

    the class is not the problem... it's the players. if people are not willed to go for the win they won't be either when using another class.
    there are people claiming thst the game would be better without the scout... well.. I'd love to play on a server without scout and trash everyone with a bipoded lmg cause there is litterally no counter to it and then read posts of people complain about Prone suppressive lmgs at the end of the map and mortar artillery trucks not ptfoing. we can go on removing everything until we have nothing left that is usable on range and still there would be people camping in corners and not giving a single f about the win. it's the players..... not the class!

    there's so much hate towards scout making people blame everything on them. it doesn't even matter how u play it, as soon as u play a lot of scout people judge u for it....
  • plasticman883
    374 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Agreed but the devs can't control human motivation i.e. the desire to not PTFO, yet they can influence how that is manifested. The simple fact of the matter is, is that it's much easier to not PTFO with scout class compared to the others as simply put, it's still possible to aquire points regardless of your team getting hung out to dry.

    I've been playing every night for at least the last 9 months and I can count the amount of times I've seen the periscope being used on one inbred hand :D. i.e. four fingers.

  • jamiestar79
    102 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    It depends on what sidearm you’re using. It’s faster to change to the Frommer Stop, than it is to the Mars Automatic, for example. But any changes haven’t been made, as far as I know. Reducing the time to switch to sidearms, would be one way of maybe not make the aggressive scout totally obsolete.

    Ah, interesting. Didnt know that. I will start practising with different guns to check it out. I like the Mars and revolvers maybe the Frommer will make a difference. Cheers.
  • Greeny_Huwjarz
    4253 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Agreed but the devs can't control human motivation i.e. the desire to not PTFO, yet they can influence how that is manifested. The simple fact of the matter is, is that it's much easier to not PTFO with scout class compared to the others as simply put, it's still possible to aquire points regardless of your team getting hung out to dry.

    I've been playing every night for at least the last 9 months and I can count the amount of times I've seen the periscope being used on one inbred hand :D. i.e. four fingers.

    Don't normal hands have 4 fingers, and a thumb? Or are 4 fingers unusual where YOU live? ;-)
  • plasticman883
    374 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    HuwJarz wrote: »
    Agreed but the devs can't control human motivation i.e. the desire to not PTFO, yet they can influence how that is manifested. The simple fact of the matter is, is that it's much easier to not PTFO with scout class compared to the others as simply put, it's still possible to aquire points regardless of your team getting hung out to dry.

    I've been playing every night for at least the last 9 months and I can count the amount of times I've seen the periscope being used on one inbred hand :D. i.e. four fingers.

    Don't normal hands have 4 fingers, and a thumb? Or are 4 fingers unusual where YOU live? ;-)

    Haha touche! 3 fingers and an opposable thumb is the norm around these ere' parts. Along with sisters and girlfriends who look suspiciously alike #banjos
  • Ronin9572
    1057 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    It might just be me but recently it seems a lot harder/slower to swap to handgun after shooting at an enemy up close with a sniper rifle - used to work just fine but more recently (and it could be me) I just seem to land the shot with the rifle and then get killed empty handed because it just seems to take so long to swap to handgun.

    Has the switch been slowed down? I used to really enjoy being an aggressive sniper where the handgun was good back up in close quarters fighting. It also feels like sprinting has been slowed but that, likewise, might just be me.

    Been wondering the same thing as of late.
  • WetFishDB
    2239 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Ploodovic wrote: »
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    While I think the Scout class is fine where it currently is, I do think their capability of playing the objective ACTIVELY aside a squad is being ground into the dirt by the upcoming CTE changes. The fastest weapon combo (since swapping to a sidearm is more doable than landing 100% headshots) isn't even fast enough in the hands of the average Joe that it could possibly beat out full auto using enemies in Cqb, even if you started firing first.

    I don't play much Scout anymore, but I'm absolutely no slouch when it comes to sniping in this game (I can't camp with them, I don't have it in me) - and it's significantly more difficult to actively PTFO with the Scout class while actually using a rifle than it was in past games.

    I can run around with the Mars and do fine with it in Cqb and even mid range by itself, but the moment I pull out a rifle in CQB I'm put at a stark disadvantage already.

    Then in comes the new TTK change that boosts the effective range and damage of almost everything but Rifles - and all its doing are forcing even decent aggro scouts back to where campers are sniping.

    I manage 40+% accuracy with rifles and even I can't stand aggro sniping on the CTE, when that patch hits the full game, I can't imagine you'll seeany Scouts on objs at all, maybe some Scouts that are dying consistently.

    For a community that makes a pastime out of complaining about camping snipers, they seem to be heavily in favor of a patch that will push most Scout players to camp.
    I fully agree with this post. As someone who mainly play scout, I’m not enjoying the gunplay on the CTE. And to so significantly change the weapon balance, more than one year after launch is, to me, mind boggling.
    It might just be me but recently it seems a lot harder/slower to swap to handgun after shooting at an enemy up close with a sniper rifle - used to work just fine but more recently (and it could be me) I just seem to land the shot with the rifle and then get killed empty handed because it just seems to take so long to swap to handgun.

    Has the switch been slowed down? I used to really enjoy being an aggressive sniper where the handgun was good back up in close quarters fighting. It also feels like sprinting has been slowed but that, likewise, might just be me.

    It depends on what sidearm you’re using. It’s faster to change to the Frommer Stop, than it is to the Mars Automatic, for example. But any changes haven’t been made, as far as I know. Reducing the time to switch to sidearms, would be one way of maybe not make the aggressive scout totally obsolete.

    Honestly, that's music to my ears. Way too many have relied on AR to play scout and get their kills (not saying that's you) but other than that, the TTK and sweet spot have remained unchanged for those weapons. Sure, others have got faster, which means its harder to play Scout up close. IMHO, rightly so.

    Hopefully we won't get as many games of CQ where half the team is Scout, almost guaranteeing a loss.
  • sfreeman73
    757 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Yet again a thread calling for something to make scouts viable again only to have it over running with haters the same players that don't complain about the flares and periscope spots. The scout class is the hardest class to PTFO and be a team player all we ask is that we get given the tools the other classes get.
  • WetFishDB
    2239 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Please if you keep adding god weapons to the medic class with the addition of their medic pack they are using and make it so difficult that even God can't kill them at least remember the players which prefer to use the scout class for authenticity of the game and add one scout rifle only one which kills with single bullet so we can keep up and kill these gods among men and remember that we used to have one rifle that was good ( Martin Henry Rifle ) and you ruin it and downgrade it

    many thanks,

    a devastated player from the scout class

    What God weapons have been added? For me the best of the lot are all in Vanilla. Autoloading (Marksman or Extended), M1917, or the Sebslader). For me, the Autoloading Marksman is king, but it's not been 'added'.
  • Loqtrall
    12314 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited November 2017
    WetFishDB wrote: »
    Ploodovic wrote: »
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    While I think the Scout class is fine where it currently is, I do think their capability of playing the objective ACTIVELY aside a squad is being ground into the dirt by the upcoming CTE changes. The fastest weapon combo (since swapping to a sidearm is more doable than landing 100% headshots) isn't even fast enough in the hands of the average Joe that it could possibly beat out full auto using enemies in Cqb, even if you started firing first.

    I don't play much Scout anymore, but I'm absolutely no slouch when it comes to sniping in this game (I can't camp with them, I don't have it in me) - and it's significantly more difficult to actively PTFO with the Scout class while actually using a rifle than it was in past games.

    I can run around with the Mars and do fine with it in Cqb and even mid range by itself, but the moment I pull out a rifle in CQB I'm put at a stark disadvantage already.

    Then in comes the new TTK change that boosts the effective range and damage of almost everything but Rifles - and all its doing are forcing even decent aggro scouts back to where campers are sniping.

    I manage 40+% accuracy with rifles and even I can't stand aggro sniping on the CTE, when that patch hits the full game, I can't imagine you'll seeany Scouts on objs at all, maybe some Scouts that are dying consistently.

    For a community that makes a pastime out of complaining about camping snipers, they seem to be heavily in favor of a patch that will push most Scout players to camp.
    I fully agree with this post. As someone who mainly play scout, I’m not enjoying the gunplay on the CTE. And to so significantly change the weapon balance, more than one year after launch is, to me, mind boggling.
    It might just be me but recently it seems a lot harder/slower to swap to handgun after shooting at an enemy up close with a sniper rifle - used to work just fine but more recently (and it could be me) I just seem to land the shot with the rifle and then get killed empty handed because it just seems to take so long to swap to handgun.

    Has the switch been slowed down? I used to really enjoy being an aggressive sniper where the handgun was good back up in close quarters fighting. It also feels like sprinting has been slowed but that, likewise, might just be me.

    It depends on what sidearm you’re using. It’s faster to change to the Frommer Stop, than it is to the Mars Automatic, for example. But any changes haven’t been made, as far as I know. Reducing the time to switch to sidearms, would be one way of maybe not make the aggressive scout totally obsolete.

    Honestly, that's music to my ears. Way too many have relied on AR to play scout and get their kills (not saying that's you) but other than that, the TTK and sweet spot have remained unchanged for those weapons. Sure, others have got faster, which means its harder to play Scout up close. IMHO, rightly so.

    Hopefully we won't get as many games of CQ where half the team is Scout, almost guaranteeing a loss.

    The only issue with that is that the majority of objectives require being "up close" to actually play, or have obstructions that make getting a nearby vantage on the obj impossible unless you're sitting at a distance on elevated hills.

    Scout being significantly harder to use compared to every other class in terms of playing the objective results in two things:

    - Droves of Scouts will start backing off objs and engaging from a distance, leaving objs and cqb to those who can actually compete without requiring unrealistic skill levels.

    - And that ^ will result in everyone in the community and the game complaining snipers are worthless, don't contribute, and cause teams to lose, despite those SAME PEOPLE arguing in favor of a TTK change that will all but erase Scouts from objective zones.

    The community treats Scouts like they can have it both ways. They treat this game like it should be possible to balance Scouts so they're completely worthless at PTFO in the hands of an average player, but also expect the Scout class to get off the hills and "contribute" despite their class being underhandedly neutered when it comes to anything but sitting in your rifles sweet spot.

    We can't have it both ways. We can't have weapons buffed so theyre almost guaranteed to beat out Scouts in the majority of PTFO situations, and ALSO expect Scouts to then attempt to PTFO when they're easily outgunned by pretty much anything else, instead of camping on hills which their class is literally being balanced to do.
  • WetFishDB
    2239 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited November 2017
    sfreeman73 wrote: »
    Yet again a thread calling for something to make scouts viable again only to have it over running with haters the same players that don't complain about the flares and periscope spots. The scout class is the hardest class to PTFO and be a team player all we ask is that we get given the tools the other classes get.

    Agree it is the hardest class to PTFO, and rightly so. That isn't really what its for. It really is for being behind the front lines themselves. They are still viable, in their right ranges. What people seem to be asking for is to make them the god killers, and frankly we already have enough morons humping hills - we don't need anything that even remotely encourages them to do more of that.

    And the AR change is nothing but a blessing. Forces players to get kills, by ... you know... aiming
  • Loqtrall
    12314 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited November 2017
    WetFishDB wrote: »

    Agree it is the hardest class to PTFO, and rightly so. That isn't really what its for. It really is for being behind the front lines themselves. They are still viable, in their right ranges.
    WetFishDB wrote: »
    and frankly we already have enough morons humping hills - we don't need anything that even remotely encourages them to do more of that.

    Don't these two statements contradict each other? You claim that class is not meant for playing the objectives and is more for sitting back, and then follow that up by claiming too many Scouts sit back on hills - and insist we don't need anything else to encourage more scouts to sit on hills, while supporting a TTK change that will encourage just that...

    You even called that change a blessing.
  • sfreeman73
    757 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Really all the scout class needs is 1 or 2 weapons that make PTFO and/or cqc viable because frankly the 1895 trench and the 1903 experimental are terrible
  • DJTERMINATOR1PSN
    218 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Honestly, you wanna make scouts more viable in playing the objective? Give them either a shotgun or full auto pistol as a secondary. When you look at the class, it makes sense that scout players play the way they do. Each rifle is specified to be a one shot kill in a certain range, which encourages them to maintain that distance from objectives where there are bound to be players within these parameters. What weapons do they have that honestly work in CQB? The Springfield with the Pedersen device? Give me a break. Now obviously you can't give them a full auto sniper rifle since those didn't exist. But Christ, you gotta give them something up close. Assault has its whole class of smgs/shotguns, medics have the Automat and M1907 Sweeper, Support have the BAR and the MG14. Scouts really only have their pistols. If you gave them the Frommer Stop Auto or the M1912 auto pistol coming into the game, suddenly a scout can be a viable threat at close range. That might make the class seem kind of unbalanced, but that's a discussion for another time. Right now I think the classes are balanced well. People might not like scouts, but ultimatley they're needed.
  • choppermeir
    29 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Surely the whole intention for the scout class is to engage at the range that best suits your weapon. I by no means condone sitting in the edge of the map not moving as a valid tactic in fact there is a special place reserved in hell for those people but the game was designed so weapons were used at their effective range, granted this all goes to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ because of the noobriegel spam and model 10 one hit kill at 10 000 metres. MH is still a god close up if ukulele the spotting flares to help you pick off what you can can and let the squad finish what's left. Too many people are obsessed with K/D when they should be more concerned with helping their squad.

    An opinion from a very average player
  • foxmuldertwobob
    124 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    When playing as a scout play to the one shot kill range of each rifle,they have a different range for some of them from 30 meters and others out to 130 meters,pick a rifle that goes with your playing style be it just back from the front line or back to a 100 meters or so, I get more one hit kills with iron sights than anything else.
  • GuN_sLiNgErXD15
    475 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    The scout class is fine, there are some fine side arms that more than complete in cqc.
    The problem lies with people playing the class incorrectly, either rushing in like Rambo or pointlessly spending all their time miles from the team.

    Play the angles, use cover, learn when to switch to your pistol and how to use your gadgets and it’s the best class going.
  • WetFishDB
    2239 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited November 2017
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    WetFishDB wrote: »

    Agree it is the hardest class to PTFO, and rightly so. That isn't really what its for. It really is for being behind the front lines themselves. They are still viable, in their right ranges.
    WetFishDB wrote: »
    and frankly we already have enough morons humping hills - we don't need anything that even remotely encourages them to do more of that.

    Don't these two statements contradict each other? You claim that class is not meant for playing the objectives and is more for sitting back, and then follow that up by claiming too many Scouts sit back on hills - and insist we don't need anything else to encourage more scouts to sit on hills, while supporting a TTK change that will encourage just that...

    You even called that change a blessing.

    No, not at all. Scout has its uses, and its neither humping hills nor trying to lead from the front. What we want is no more than a handful of them, just behind the front lines (not camping in some remote spot like up a hill), supporting them with spot flares and picking off the hill humping n00bs, or the medics etc. They shouldn't be the first ones to jump on the flag and engage a group of enemies for obvious reasons - that isn't what the class is for, nor good at.
    //
    Most scouts realise they can't be right in the front line, but unfortunately in doing so, they then go hide somewhere in one spot trying to pick the odd person off. Those are the ones, if you have too many of them, that cause teams to lose. The TTK won't change that one bit, campers are always gonna camp. Those that know how to play Scout will continue to do so. However, those that abuse AR and sweetspot ranges, will now realise that they are going to have to adapt and either find a different style, a different class, or learn how to aim - none of which is a bad thing IMHO.
    The scout class is fine, there are some fine side arms that more than complete in cqc.
    The problem lies with people playing the class incorrectly, either rushing in like Rambo or pointlessly spending all their time miles from the team.

    Play the angles, use cover, learn when to switch to your pistol and how to use your gadgets and it’s the best class going.

    Precisely my point. And described much better than I ever could.
  • Loqtrall
    12314 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited November 2017
    WetFishDB wrote: »
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    You even called that change a blessing.

    No, not at all. Scout has its uses, and its neither humping hills nor trying to lead from the front. What we want is no more than a handful of them, just behind the front lines (not camping in some remote spot like up a hill), supporting them with spot flares and picking off the hill humping n00bs, or the medics etc. They shouldn't be the first ones to jump on the flag and engage a group of enemies for obvious reasons - that isn't what the class is for, nor good at.
    //
    Most scouts realise they can't be right in the front line, but unfortunately in doing so, they then go hide somewhere in one spot trying to pick the odd person off. Those are the ones, if you have too many of them, that cause teams to lose. The TTK won't change that one bit, campers are always gonna camp. Those that know how to play Scout will continue to do so. However, those that abuse AR and sweetspot ranges, will now realise that they are going to have to adapt and either find a different style, a different class, or learn how to aim - none of which is a bad thing IMHO.

    So you not only want "just a handful" of Scouts, but you then want to control how those Scouts play?

    Again, ladies and gentlemen - the forum Scout bias.

    Again, I don't see anyone complaining about camping support players or people who sit on the sides of maps with artillery trucks, but it's the Scout class that definitely needs to be limited and controlled in how they play?

    That would be akin to wanting EVERY Medic on the front lines focusing on nothing but healing despite there being more to the class. Or expecting EVERY Support player to follow people around and drop ammo, despite there being more to the class.

    You want Scout designed to play one specific, singular role on the field universally, while other classes are running around engaging from all sorts of ranges and doing other things besides healing, resupplying, or destroying vehicles. Hell, the Medic class and Support class both have bipod scoped variants of weapons that allow them to play at the exact ranges you're saying Scouts should only play at. Medics even have weapons that allow them to play in Cqb effectively, making it a class that can be used at nearly EVERY range - but, you know, Scout should only be played by sitting back as a support role despite there being a class called Support that already does that job and others.

    I mean really, every other class has weapons to engage at multiple ranges, are about to receive buffs to those ranges, and are capable of directly playing objectives ON obj points.

    But the Scout is "meant" to stay back and not a PTFO?

    Sorry, but that sounds awfully strange to a guy like me, who spent 99% of his time playing BF3 and BF4 as an aggro sniper who ran from obj to obj. Like the other classes, there should be SOME option to play in aggressive, PTFO situations that literally every other class has.

    The Medic class in general is balanced for mid range but they still have the Fedorov and Sweeper for Cqb. Oh, and let's not forget the 2 shot kill range increase from 48m to 70m for the RSC!

    Assault is generally balanced for Cqb, but they still have the Ribey that allows them to engage targets further than a few dozen meters, and they have Slug shotguns you can literally snipe with.

    So what is this nonsense that the Scout class is the one class that deserves one type of weapon for playing at one specific range, as every other class actually and actively contribute to the team effort with ease? Why should it be SO MUCH HARDER for a Scout to contribute directly to playing the objective, while any 13 year old could do it easily with Medic, Support, or Assault? Why is Scout the only class that regularly relies on a sidearm to consistently achieve kills in Cqb? Even the "closer ranged" rifles like the Vetterli and m.95 are terrible by themselves in aggro situations, and the TTK change is going to make them even worse.

    lol nobody is even bringing up that Scout class sidearm wont be crap compared to the future buffed automatic weapons.

    I mean, really - abusing auto rotation and sweet spots? If you're in cqb, you're not hitting sweet spots, and everyone else has the same AR you do. No rifle OHKs except with a headshots in cqb, and you can snap to targets in cqb with the Assault class just as much as you can as Scout.

    If you regularly got beat by Scouts in Cqb in this game, that's either a personal issue or you ran into the one Scout in the entire game that has a 100% headshots ratio. Because I adored aggro sniping in BF3 and BF4 and absolutely can't stand it in this game. I have nearly 50% rifle accuracy and I'd still rather walk around D with a frommer stop or Mars while on the objective (because even the quickest pop n swap aggro scout combo in this game has a slower TTK than the majority of automatic weapons in this game BEFORE the TTK changes).

    You're sitting here saying after the TTK changes aggro Scouts are just gonna need to "learn how to aim" if they want to continue playing like they do - but do you realize that would mean killing EVERYONE you see with a headshot in cqb? How can you tell someone to "learn to aim" in that situation when 9 times out of 10 they're going up against people that are just spraying at them with automatic bullet hoses you can literally fire from the hip at those ranges?

    As someone with better rifle accuracy than most people I run into on here, that all sounds like absolute nonsensical BS.

    I mean, I just had the guy in another sniper thread tell me it's "obvious" Scouts are the main problem when a team loses, and I just played a match of CQL last night where my team got decimated, and we had TWO Scout players on our team. The game ended something like 1000 to 600~, but I guess that was the fault of those two Scouts on my team. I even have screenshots and a battle report to prove it.
  • Greeny_Huwjarz
    4253 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    WetFishDB wrote: »
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    You even called that change a blessing.

    No, not at all. Scout has its uses, and its neither humping hills nor trying to lead from the front. What we want is no more than a handful of them, just behind the front lines (not camping in some remote spot like up a hill), supporting them with spot flares and picking off the hill humping n00bs, or the medics etc. They shouldn't be the first ones to jump on the flag and engage a group of enemies for obvious reasons - that isn't what the class is for, nor good at.
    //
    Most scouts realise they can't be right in the front line, but unfortunately in doing so, they then go hide somewhere in one spot trying to pick the odd person off. Those are the ones, if you have too many of them, that cause teams to lose. The TTK won't change that one bit, campers are always gonna camp. Those that know how to play Scout will continue to do so. However, those that abuse AR and sweetspot ranges, will now realise that they are going to have to adapt and either find a different style, a different class, or learn how to aim - none of which is a bad thing IMHO.

    So you not only want "just a handful" of Scouts, but you then want to control how those Scouts play?

    Again, ladies and gentlemen - the forum Scout bias.

    Again, I don't see anyone complaining about camping support players or people who sit on the sides of maps with artillery trucks, but it's the Scout class that definitely needs to be limited and controlled in how they play?

    That would be akin to wanting EVERY Medic on the front lines focusing on nothing but healing despite there being more to the class. Or expecting EVERY Support player to follow people around and drop ammo, despite there being more to the class.

    You want Scout designed to play one specific, singular role on the field universally, while other classes are running around engaging from all sorts of ranges and doing other things besides healing, resupplying, or destroying vehicles. Hell, the Medic class and Support class both have bipod scoped variants of weapons that allow them to play at the exact ranges you're saying Scouts should only play at. Medics even have weapons that allow them to play in Cqb effectively, making it a class that can be used at nearly EVERY range - but, you know, Scout should only be played by sitting back as a support role despite there being a class called Support that already does that job and others.

    I mean really, every other class has weapons to engage at multiple ranges, are about to receive buffs to those ranges, and are capable of directly playing objectives ON obj points.

    But the Scout is "meant" to stay back and not a PTFO?

    Sorry, but that sounds awfully strange to a guy like me, who spent 99% of his time playing BF3 and BF4 as an aggro sniper who ran from obj to obj. Like the other classes, there should be SOME option to play in aggressive, PTFO situations that literally every other class has.

    The Medic class in general is balanced for mid range but they still have the Fedorov and Sweeper for Cqb. Oh, and let's not forget the 2 shot kill range increase from 48m to 70m for the RSC!

    Assault is generally balanced for Cqb, but they still have the Ribey that allows them to engage targets further than a few dozen meters, and they have Slug shotguns you can literally snipe with.

    So what is this nonsense that the Scout class is the one class that deserves one type of weapon for playing at one specific range, as every other class actually and actively contribute to the team effort with ease? Why should it be SO MUCH HARDER for a Scout to contribute directly to playing the objective, while any 13 year old could do it easily with Medic, Support, or Assault? Why is Scout the only class that regularly relies on a sidearm to consistently achieve kills in Cqb? Even the "closer ranged" rifles like the Vetterli and m.95 are terrible by themselves in aggro situations, and the TTK change is going to make them even worse.

    lol nobody is even bringing up that Scout class sidearm wont be crap compared to the future buffed automatic weapons.

    I mean, really - abusing auto rotation and sweet spots? If you're in cqb, you're not hitting sweet spots, and everyone else has the same AR you do. No rifle OHKs except with a headshots in cqb, and you can snap to targets in cqb with the Assault class just as much as you can as Scout.

    If you regularly got beat by Scouts in Cqb in this game, that's either a personal issue or you ran into the one Scout in the entire game that has a 100% headshots ratio. Because I adored aggro sniping in BF3 and BF4 and absolutely can't stand it in this game. I have nearly 50% rifle accuracy and I'd still rather walk around D with a frommer stop or Mars while on the objective (because even the quickest pop n swap aggro scout combo in this game has a slower TTK than the majority of automatic weapons in this game BEFORE the TTK changes).

    You're sitting here saying after the TTK changes aggro Scouts are just gonna need to "learn how to aim" if they want to continue playing like they do - but do you realize that would mean killing EVERYONE you see with a headshot in cqb? How can you tell someone to "learn to aim" in that situation when 9 times out of 10 they're going up against people that are just spraying at them with automatic bullet hoses you can literally fire from the hip at those ranges?

    As someone with better rifle accuracy than most people I run into on here, that all sounds like absolute nonsensical BS.

    I mean, I just had the guy in another sniper thread tell me it's "obvious" Scouts are the main problem when a team loses, and I just played a match of CQL last night where my team got decimated, and we had TWO Scout players on our team. The game ended something like 1000 to 600~, but I guess that was the fault of those two Scouts on my team. I even have screenshots and a battle report to prove it.

    Hold on - don't you have the Experimental for CQC? :D

    This debate is a good one, but also one that is becoming unnecessarily technical.

    The hatred for snipers, and I mean snipers, is that they lose the respect of other players because they contribute very little to a team. On the other hand, people that squad play and run with a decent SCOUT, supporting their team to take objectives are like gold dust with their flares and one hit kills.

    There seems to be a lot of chat about the AA, and the snap to target and I don't see much opposition to the proposed new hit box rules - snarling to arms or legs if not in target rather that a OHK when the sights were not even ion the target

    Personally I would change it so that he sweet spot goes, with the new hotbox, but with a sniper headshot being a OHK at any range.
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