Elitism in the battlefield community

Comments

  • Granathar
    249 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    edited January 2018
    Granathar wrote: »
    "Skillcannons" are crap for agressive, dynamic players that don't like to waste 3/4 of their playtime on reloading the gun while dead and injured allies are laying around. Cutting 100 ms in TTK is just not worth all the downsides that come solely from low ammo capacity.

    @ProLegion_exor

    I had a chat with Exor already about this, and we generally speaking both agree that AL 8 TTK advantage is really important only when facing experienced players with AL 8 - and it's by no means universally best SLR, just suited for "burst" Medic playstyle. Also remember that Exor plays nearly only Domination, while most people (including me) play Conquest and Operations. That's pretty huge difference in playstyle.

    He is also but one person that achieved symbiotic relation with AL 8 MM. Only because there is one person like that we all should run with AL 8 MM and leave ourselves at disadvantage because FEW best players said it's best? I suppose there are some top level players with 100 Service Stars with f.e. MP18, why nobody admits that MP18 is best SMG?

    Skillcannons require specific circumstances and specific playstyle to be effective, FH is effective in every playstyle that is not extreme CQC berserking (but to be honest these 468 ms of minimum TTK is not THIS bad and I win accidental CQC quite a lot with it anyways - it may change after TTK patch).
  • woll3
    677 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Granathar wrote: »

    Skillcannons require specific circumstances and specific playstyle to be effective,

    Heres the thing, something that is low recoil, high rof and high damage isnt a skillcannon by default, and if the TTK Narrative applied the 1916 actually takes the most skill to use at 100% efficiency, which would actually be true, not to mention that the whole TTK narrative falls apart(to a certain degree) once you take map design and players into account.
  • Dogwoggle11
    2678 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Granathar wrote: »
    Granathar wrote: »
    "Skillcannons" are crap for agressive, dynamic players that don't like to waste 3/4 of their playtime on reloading the gun while dead and injured allies are laying around. Cutting 100 ms in TTK is just not worth all the downsides that come solely from low ammo capacity.

    @ProLegion_exor

    I had a chat with Exor already about this, and we generally speaking both agree that AL 8 TTK advantage is really important only when facing experienced players with AL 8 - and it's by no means universally best SLR, just suited for "burst" Medic playstyle. Also remember that Exor plays nearly only Domination, while most people (including me) play Conquest and Operations. That's pretty huge difference in playstyle.

    He is also but one person that achieved symbiotic relation with AL 8 MM. Only because there is one person like that we all should run with AL 8 MM and leave ourselves at disadvantage because FEW best players said it's best? I suppose there are some top level players with 100 Service Stars with f.e. MP18, why nobody admits that MP18 is best SMG?

    Skillcannons require specific circumstances and specific playstyle to be effective, FH is effective in every playstyle that is not extreme CQC berserking (but to be honest these 468 ms of minimum TTK is not THIS bad and I win accidental CQC quite a lot with it anyways - it may change after TTK patch).

    I use the AL8 too, and lately I've been seeing more and more players using it and other "skill cannons" effectively.
    I'm not saying that they are the best choice for everyone, but they certainly aren't "crap for aggressive, dynamic players" either.
  • IIRogueMachineII
    1337 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited January 2018
    Wouldn’t say BF1 is overly casual it’s more to do with how un casual BF4 was. I mean sure for higher skilled players will probably undeniably be pretty dominant. A lot of it comes from the high skilled players not liking getting killed by “inferior” players in their view. Fine dunking on people in Attack helicopters but dislike be killed by someone sweetspotting them!!! It’s a video game. You are going to get killed just because you can potentially die easier in certain ways compared to 4 but that’s the game. There’s a huge elitism by the YouTubers and streamers who arguably make up the smallest percentage of the player base and their arguably the most elitist. Whether it’s down to BF1 not being “great to stream” or “it’s too casual” and truck load of other statements I’ve heard them say. Fact is they don’t like getting killed unless some has “outskilled” them. Bottom line is if the streamers and YouTubers didn’t feel like this than lots more people wouldn’t either. BF1 may not be perfect and does have gimmicks which are unneeded elites and behemoths but in my opinion it’s an vast improvement over 4.
    Post edited by IIRogueMachineII on
  • Greeny_Huwjarz
    4334 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Granathar wrote: »
    Temp1st wrote: »
    Let's not forget Lvlcap trashed on the skill cannon SLR's (Seb06/RSC/AL8) and said Seb16 was the best SLR in the game for the longest time..

    Let that sink in.

    Umm, it's probably because Seb06/RSC/AL8 are not the best weapons by any means and few elitists touching their **** to them because of their magdump'n'run tactics will not change it. They are just not this good as people claim and I will always say that. Saying that Seb06/RSC/AL8 are best is like saying that Maschinenpistole M1912 is best weapon for Assault because MUH LOW TTK DUHHHH.

    Nobody uses it, and I still find Automatico better, because it has a little bit higher TTK, but larger magazine and faster reload making you more versatile and resistant to multiple enemies encounters. And I still think that Hellriegel is actually better than Automatico - because again, you sacrifice raw optimistic TTK for larger mag and better ADS accuracy so you can be more effective mid-range. Hellriegel actually leaves you with chance of winning against Support and Medic outside extreme CQC - and that saved me a LOT of times, that's why I prefer Hellriegel over Automatico. Raw TTK is not everything.

    And best SLR all-round is Farquhar Hill Optical. I have 2.9 KPM with it, 15 **** so far. It's not the king of CQC but I win with it quite a lot of times actually and makes you dangerous at every distance due to it's damage model and bullet velocity. But most importantly - it has pretty large mag. When I see like 3 guys going out of the trenches - I kill 2 of them before the 3rd one notices me, and due to it's pretty good midrange TTK I kill the 3rd guy too most of the times. With AL8 it's probably better idea to run away after noticing them because you will kill one of them and others won't let you run away. So stand and fight for 1/1 KD or run away with 0/0, while FH will make you 2/1 or even 3/0 in the same situation, because you don't even have to think about what to do - you just open fire immediatly without wasting time knowing that you won't run out of ammo.

    I waste less time reloading so I have time to actually revive people and drop them health pouches, because it won't interrupt my eternal reload. I had many situations where AL 8 forced me to decide - run away while reloading or run away while reviving the guy, because I have no ammo and enemy just noticed me. With FH I just fire back at the guy, drop health pouch for myself and revive the guy after that while wasting ZERO time for reloading and being able to defend myself all the damn time. Also FH leaves me margin of error that also helps in survival, it's faster to fire another bullet than to switch to sidearm.

    "Skillcannons" are crap for agressive, dynamic players that don't like to waste 3/4 of their playtime on reloading the gun while dead and injured allies are laying around. Cutting 100 ms in TTK is just not worth all the downsides that come solely from low ammo capacity.

    II could not agree more with this, except with your choice of all rounder!

    I've extensively used (several service stars with all medic weapons, and most of them with 3* plus and 8 medic weapons with 10* or more) all the medic rifles and 850 medic hours.

    I totally agree with the points you make about the trade off of TTK and the extra mag capacity. Especially if (like you and me), you are think in the heart of the action. I would also add an additional point: I think that the downside of missing a moving target with a skill cannon is very large and often results in your death. For the reasons that you state, I use the Selby Marksman as a primary and when I playing CQM maps, Suez, Argonne or Fort De Vaux, I will switch to AL Extended, , F/Q Hill Optical or Federov Optical, dependent on my mood.

    As many here know, I like my stats, and so for the last few days, I decided to have some gaming sessions where I played only Skill cannons. For example, I restricted my play in games to the 1906, AL MarksMan, RSC and took a note of my kills and K/D ratio.

    In the games that I noted where I had my preferred Selby Marksman or A/L Ext - My K/D was always 3.00+ and I AVERAGED nearly 36 kills per game of conquest with a peak of 54 kills.

    In the games with there skill cannons, my K/D dropped on EVERY game to sub 3.00 (in the range 1.8 to 3.00), In addition my kills per game dropped to 27 kills per game. I only once managed 40 kills in a round. The exception was Fort De Vaux - I was consistently killing more, but sometime with a relatively terrible K/D ranging down to 1.3.....

    This is a huge degradation in performance in percentage terms. Conclusion: I'll still use the skill cannons for fun, to test myself, from time to time but my "go-to" weapons are now pretty well defined.

    Game mode also matters. Domination is very fast paced and TTK is ,much more important. I also believe there is is higher percentage of skilled players playing that game mode (just my feeling, no evidence). The Selby Marksman stays in the armoury and there I happily switch to faster TTK weapons.

    There may be an elite of players like @ProLegion_exor and @WetFishDB @The_BERG_366 berg that have the accuracy and reactions to make a skill cannons work. But we are talking about exceptional players. I think for us mere mortals, other guns are far more forgiving and optimise performance.

    This has been an interesting thread for us medics......Some good debate.
  • ProLegion_exor
    3541 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    HuwJarz wrote: »
    Granathar wrote: »
    Temp1st wrote: »
    Let's not forget Lvlcap trashed on the skill cannon SLR's (Seb06/RSC/AL8) and said Seb16 was the best SLR in the game for the longest time..

    Let that sink in.

    Umm, it's probably because Seb06/RSC/AL8 are not the best weapons by any means and few elitists touching their **** to them because of their magdump'n'run tactics will not change it. They are just not this good as people claim and I will always say that. Saying that Seb06/RSC/AL8 are best is like saying that Maschinenpistole M1912 is best weapon for Assault because MUH LOW TTK DUHHHH.

    Nobody uses it, and I still find Automatico better, because it has a little bit higher TTK, but larger magazine and faster reload making you more versatile and resistant to multiple enemies encounters. And I still think that Hellriegel is actually better than Automatico - because again, you sacrifice raw optimistic TTK for larger mag and better ADS accuracy so you can be more effective mid-range. Hellriegel actually leaves you with chance of winning against Support and Medic outside extreme CQC - and that saved me a LOT of times, that's why I prefer Hellriegel over Automatico. Raw TTK is not everything.

    And best SLR all-round is Farquhar Hill Optical. I have 2.9 KPM with it, 15 **** so far. It's not the king of CQC but I win with it quite a lot of times actually and makes you dangerous at every distance due to it's damage model and bullet velocity. But most importantly - it has pretty large mag. When I see like 3 guys going out of the trenches - I kill 2 of them before the 3rd one notices me, and due to it's pretty good midrange TTK I kill the 3rd guy too most of the times. With AL8 it's probably better idea to run away after noticing them because you will kill one of them and others won't let you run away. So stand and fight for 1/1 KD or run away with 0/0, while FH will make you 2/1 or even 3/0 in the same situation, because you don't even have to think about what to do - you just open fire immediatly without wasting time knowing that you won't run out of ammo.

    I waste less time reloading so I have time to actually revive people and drop them health pouches, because it won't interrupt my eternal reload. I had many situations where AL 8 forced me to decide - run away while reloading or run away while reviving the guy, because I have no ammo and enemy just noticed me. With FH I just fire back at the guy, drop health pouch for myself and revive the guy after that while wasting ZERO time for reloading and being able to defend myself all the damn time. Also FH leaves me margin of error that also helps in survival, it's faster to fire another bullet than to switch to sidearm.

    "Skillcannons" are crap for agressive, dynamic players that don't like to waste 3/4 of their playtime on reloading the gun while dead and injured allies are laying around. Cutting 100 ms in TTK is just not worth all the downsides that come solely from low ammo capacity.

    II could not agree more with this, except with your choice of all rounder!

    I've extensively used (several service stars with all medic weapons, and most of them with 3* plus and 8 medic weapons with 10* or more) all the medic rifles and 850 medic hours.

    I totally agree with the points you make about the trade off of TTK and the extra mag capacity. Especially if (like you and me), you are think in the heart of the action. I would also add an additional point: I think that the downside of missing a moving target with a skill cannon is very large and often results in your death. For the reasons that you state, I use the Selby Marksman as a primary and when I playing CQM maps, Suez, Argonne or Fort De Vaux, I will switch to AL Extended, , F/Q Hill Optical or Federov Optical, dependent on my mood.

    As many here know, I like my stats, and so for the last few days, I decided to have some gaming sessions where I played only Skill cannons. For example, I restricted my play in games to the 1906, AL MarksMan, RSC and took a note of my kills and K/D ratio.

    In the games that I noted where I had my preferred Selby Marksman or A/L Ext - My K/D was always 3.00+ and I AVERAGED nearly 36 kills per game of conquest with a peak of 54 kills.

    In the games with there skill cannons, my K/D dropped on EVERY game to sub 3.00 (in the range 1.8 to 3.00), In addition my kills per game dropped to 27 kills per game. I only once managed 40 kills in a round. The exception was Fort De Vaux - I was consistently killing more, but sometime with a relatively terrible K/D ranging down to 1.3.....

    This is a huge degradation in performance in percentage terms. Conclusion: I'll still use the skill cannons for fun, to test myself, from time to time but my "go-to" weapons are now pretty well defined.

    Game mode also matters. Domination is very fast paced and TTK is ,much more important. I also believe there is is higher percentage of skilled players playing that game mode (just my feeling, no evidence). The Selby Marksman stays in the armoury and there I happily switch to faster TTK weapons.

    There may be an elite of players like @ProLegion_exor and @WetFishDB @The_BERG_366 berg that have the accuracy and reactions to make a skill cannons work. But we are talking about exceptional players. I think for us mere mortals, other guns are far more forgiving and optimise performance.

    This has been an interesting thread for us medics......Some good debate.

    This is a good quite accurate to how I feel also.
    @Granathar @Dogwoggle11
  • Dogwoggle11
    2678 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Good points, everyone, of course.

    I am an average player with the AL8, and I enjoy it because it is a challenging, high risk high reward weapon. I'm never bored while using it.

    Yes, I think it depends heavily on the game mode too; DOM and TDM being probably the best for these type of weapons.
    Also, having aiming problems (or just a bad day, it happens) will result in a lot of frustration.
    It still happens to me sometimes that my bullets do a perfect circle around my target and I find myself in a tough situation; or when I encounter 2 or more enemies, but I usually manage to kill one and then dodge and get the second with the sidearm, but obviously it would be a lot safer to have more bullets on my primary.

    Still, skillcannons are fun to use, and don't necessarily mean that you will be useless. It's just a more challenging experience.
  • FightinFinn187
    734 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    xenome111 wrote: »
    Im been noticing people say " battlefield 3 was much better than bf1" people calling anyone who likes bf1 casual even youtubers like LVLCAP saying bf1 casual nothing like bf4 and stuff like "all cod players moved to battlefield" battlefiled more casual. I thought to my self people say bf2 was the most skill in the series ( what people say) i played bf2 on hub that game was AWFUL grenade spam op jets etc is it just people have rose tinted glasses in the community or something plz explain

    LOL. Jets r meant to be paper planes then.
    And don't forget bf1 had the worst grenade spams in BF franchise.

    Take those rose tinted glasses off and play a couple rounds of Metro or Lockers and get back to me. They are the epitome of grenade spam.
  • Greeny_Huwjarz
    4334 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Good points, everyone, of course.

    I am an average player with the AL8, and I enjoy it because it is a challenging, high risk high reward weapon. I'm never bored while using it.

    Yes, I think it depends heavily on the game mode too; DOM and TDM being probably the best for these type of weapons.
    Also, having aiming problems (or just a bad day, it happens) will result in a lot of frustration.
    It still happens to me sometimes that my bullets do a perfect circle around my target and I find myself in a tough situation; or when I encounter 2 or more enemies, but I usually manage to kill one and then dodge and get the second with the sidearm, but obviously it would be a lot safer to have more bullets on my primary.

    Still, skillcannons are fun to use, and don't necessarily mean that you will be useless. It's just a more challenging experience.

    Hi Dogwoggle,

    Tell me - I see a number of people call it high reward. The reward is killing one, maybe 2 people tops with a skill cannon. What is this high reward you speak of? I'm not being sarcastic, I like this debate....

    I do understand that there are SOME occasions where if you use an AL8 our AL Marksman, that the TTK helps you win a 121 that you would have otherwise lost. However, that is outweighed IMO by the number of occasions that you describe where one runs into multiples....

    The more I read of this thread, the more elitism I think there is. I think its OK to want to challenge oneself. I do it too.. I was running the 1906 Sniper today for the fun of it, but that is different from people using them all the time to prove somehow that they are some sort of gaming gods.....I think any of them would do better with AL Extended or F/G or Federov.....

    Am I wrong?
  • CHAMMOND1992
    1394 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited January 2018
    Obviously elitism exists. If it didn't, the term "skill cannon" would have never even existed. Lets take all the guns, look at the percentage of it's use amongst the player base, then value it higher than any other weapon. Great, now I feel better for using it.
  • ProLegion_exor
    3541 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    HuwJarz wrote: »
    Good points, everyone, of course.

    I am an average player with the AL8, and I enjoy it because it is a challenging, high risk high reward weapon. I'm never bored while using it.

    Yes, I think it depends heavily on the game mode too; DOM and TDM being probably the best for these type of weapons.
    Also, having aiming problems (or just a bad day, it happens) will result in a lot of frustration.
    It still happens to me sometimes that my bullets do a perfect circle around my target and I find myself in a tough situation; or when I encounter 2 or more enemies, but I usually manage to kill one and then dodge and get the second with the sidearm, but obviously it would be a lot safer to have more bullets on my primary.

    Still, skillcannons are fun to use, and don't necessarily mean that you will be useless. It's just a more challenging experience.

    Hi Dogwoggle,

    Tell me - I see a number of people call it high reward. The reward is killing one, maybe 2 people tops with a skill cannon. What is this high reward you speak of? I'm not being sarcastic, I like this debate....

    I do understand that there are SOME occasions where if you use an AL8 our AL Marksman, that the TTK helps you win a 121 that you would have otherwise lost. However, that is outweighed IMO by the number of occasions that you describe where one runs into multiples....

    The more I read of this thread, the more elitism I think there is. I think its OK to want to challenge oneself. I do it too.. I was running the 1906 Sniper today for the fun of it, but that is different from people using them all the time to prove somehow that they are some sort of gaming gods.....I think any of them would do better with AL Extended or F/G or Federov.....

    Am I wrong?

    The reward for me it´s just not only 1 kill. It brings a certain amount of preassure on myself to "perform". Because if I don´t I´ll do terrible with it. Others maybe refeer it as the reward that they actually did something to earn that kill. Myself find it fun to use something less common.

    I don´t think I´m the right player to say how I perform with what etc.
  • Dogwoggle11
    2678 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    HuwJarz wrote: »
    Good points, everyone, of course.

    I am an average player with the AL8, and I enjoy it because it is a challenging, high risk high reward weapon. I'm never bored while using it.

    Yes, I think it depends heavily on the game mode too; DOM and TDM being probably the best for these type of weapons.
    Also, having aiming problems (or just a bad day, it happens) will result in a lot of frustration.
    It still happens to me sometimes that my bullets do a perfect circle around my target and I find myself in a tough situation; or when I encounter 2 or more enemies, but I usually manage to kill one and then dodge and get the second with the sidearm, but obviously it would be a lot safer to have more bullets on my primary.

    Still, skillcannons are fun to use, and don't necessarily mean that you will be useless. It's just a more challenging experience.

    Hi Dogwoggle,

    Tell me - I see a number of people call it high reward. The reward is killing one, maybe 2 people tops with a skill cannon. What is this high reward you speak of? I'm not being sarcastic, I like this debate....

    I do understand that there are SOME occasions where if you use an AL8 our AL Marksman, that the TTK helps you win a 121 that you would have otherwise lost. However, that is outweighed IMO by the number of occasions that you describe where one runs into multiples....

    The more I read of this thread, the more elitism I think there is. I think its OK to want to challenge oneself. I do it too.. I was running the 1906 Sniper today for the fun of it, but that is different from people using them all the time to prove somehow that they are some sort of gaming gods.....I think any of them would do better with AL Extended or F/G or Federov.....

    Am I wrong?

    I meant the high risk high reward as a more general concept. High risk being the limited ammo, and high reward the possibility to pretty much win every 1v1.

    I don't think you are wrong about the elitism. Of course there are people who do what you describe; but I don't think there is elitism on this thread.
    I've said that the "skill cannons" depend on game mode, aim, maps... and it's true. They are not unbeatable, and a skilled player can use pretty much any weapon in the game and perform well - one doesn't need a Selb06, RSC, AL8...

    I am an average player. I use every SLR, depending on the situation or what I like at the time. I think my most used weapon is the SL Trench, and then Autoloading Extended. I don't have elitism in me, hahaha.
  • woll3
    677 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member


    I meant the high risk high reward as a more general concept. High risk being the limited ammo, and high reward the possibility to pretty much win every 1v1.

    Except when you are flinching, are supressed or actually encounter players with good movement, not to mention as usual, that there is another SLR that has the same TTK when it comes to pushing objectives. As mentioned before, there is a good reason why nobody is using it in Matches, might be different with autoaiming though.
  • ProLegion_exor
    3541 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    woll3 wrote: »


    I meant the high risk high reward as a more general concept. High risk being the limited ammo, and high reward the possibility to pretty much win every 1v1.

    Except when you are flinching, are supressed or actually encounter players with good movement, not to mention as usual, that there is another SLR that has the same TTK when it comes to pushing objectives. As mentioned before, there is a good reason why nobody is using it in Matches, might be different with autoaiming though.

    On PS4 it´s banned in "matches". Thats why nobody is using it.. ;)
  • woll3
    677 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    On PS4 it´s banned in "matches". Thats why nobody is using it.. ;)


    Well, you know how much i care about console. :P
  • ProLegion_exor
    3541 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    woll3 wrote: »
    On PS4 it´s banned in "matches". Thats why nobody is using it.. ;)


    Well, you know how much i care about console. :P

    None..
    But you can´t base facts that nobody else is playing on console.

    Peak PC - 30,573
    Peak Console - 98,445

    Current PC - 9,834
    Current Console - 45,619
  • SFSeventh
    271 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    BF1 is aimed a little more at the casual gamer than the games that came before it BUT that dosent necessairly make it a casual game. Sure it dosent have hardcore TTK and deep mechanics but it's not a run and gun arcade fps either. Especially with this game i think dice/ea wanted to steal as many players from competitors (mainly cod players who were tired of the futuristic setting of their franchise at the time).
    Personally i do not care, i have fun with bf1 despite it's flaws and it being a little simpler for everyone to pick up.
    If i had 1$ for every time someone rages in chat calling this game casul trash and saying CSGO is better and where all the skilled players are i'd be rich.
    We can argue to infinity if this game is casual or not. The next BF title is at the mercy of the devs and they alone will choose to make the game as casual oriented or as hardcore as they wish. Keep in mind that a game too difficult to pick up dosent sell well to the average joe even if that means pleasing the elite ''few'' sales matter to the publisher and they will simplify the game if it means that will sell better.
  • woll3
    677 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    None..
    But you can´t base facts that nobody else is playing on console.

    Peak PC - 30,573
    Peak Console - 98,445

    Current PC - 9,834
    Current Console - 45,619

    Who is doing that? Regardless that is just what happens when you put a game with lack of polish and features on a competitive market.
  • woll3
    677 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    None..
    But you can´t base facts that nobody else is playing on console.

    Peak PC - 30,573
    Peak Console - 98,445

    Current PC - 9,834
    Current Console - 45,619

    Who is doing that? Regardless that is just what happens when you put a game with lack of polish and features on a competitive market.
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