Are scouts that op?

Comments

  • BaronVonGoon
    4455 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Two things that are new to scout/recon (meaning they weren't in BF3 or BF4):
    -One shot kill sweet spot
    -Auto Rotation aim assist (console)

    Which class benefits the most from gaining such crutches?
  • theONEFORCE
    2598 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Scouts aren’t OP, but they are still extremely easy to use compared to previous BF titles, even after the autorotation nerf, and will still be easy to use after the TTK changes.

    End of thread.
  • obisearch
    682 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited January 11
    Two things that are new to scout/recon (meaning they weren't in BF3 or BF4):
    -One shot kill sweet spot
    -Auto Rotation aim assist (console)

    Which class benefits the most from gaining such crutches?

    There was autorotation in BF4 if you chose the right settings but obviously there are far more scopes so mostly do not see benefits.
    Any scout worth there salt does not use ar, besides ALL classes benefit from ar, scouts benefiting most is a myth.

    Sweet spot itself is far overated, say a sweet spot is 30-60m 50% of the time is when damage is declining or increasing leaving around 15m being the actual kill range the other 15m offers increased damage but no kill at full health. The exception being the MH as that has a higher than 100 maximum.

    Let's not beat around the bush here, this thread is about snipers being relevant at med/ aggro range. sniping is harder in BF4 on long ranges, but it was very viable and NOT hard on med/aggro range because
    1.scopes for short ranges is legit. Infact I ran acog or ps04 main on scopes and the headshots was strong with that one.
    2. G18 - getting glocked is a thing for an op sidearm that kills as quick as a val
    3. Access to other gun models. How can PTO be harder on BF4 when you have access to DTRs, carbines and shotguns?

    Honestly guys take your rose tint glasses off for bf4 only one aspect of this class is hard
    Post edited by obisearch on
  • disposalist
    6920 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    I believe the answer is yes and no.

    Scouts are, relatively, easy to use in BF1: -

    Lack of audio spotting and difficult of normal spotting means staying hidden at close range (relative to what you might ordinarily think is 'sniping' range)
    High velocity rounds mean very little leading is needed
    ZERO random deviation means you hit exactly what you aim at unlike every other weapon
    Perfectly manufacturer and calibrated scopes were a surprise in WW1 weapons
    High damage first hits and assist kills mean often killing in one or at least being awarded a kill before the enemy knows they are under fire
    Sweet spot mechanic is brutal either randomly or if you actually know how to use it, very effectively
    Excellent pistols mitigate a lot of the CQC problems scouts might have
    Gadgets tailored to survival
    I'm probably forgetting more...

    The combo of those aspects *should* make them amazingly effective. It doesn't, but not for a good reason.

    All of that is an advantage at range, which often means off and/or nowhere near the objectives, so being an effective team/squad member is often out. All of that makes them attractive to noobs who want to stop dying in CQC but still get kills, so the effectiveness stats are skewed by the number of new players using the kit.

    It *can be* an effective kit if the sniper targets the objective his squad is attacking/defending, but there are much more KD lucrative approaches to sniping that seem to be the usual focus. If by 'effective' you mean 'high KD' then, yeah, sniping is effective.

    It *can be* effective if the scout takes a closer range rifle, clears flags covering/supporting his squad and moves onto flags and uses flares, but then the kit because difficult and dangerous. Not many do this.

    It *can be* effective until there are more than a handful of snipers. There are only so many enemy wandering about in the open and after a few snipers are spawned you are taking each others kills and not inly becoming less and less individually effective but ruining the game for you team who no longer have enough PTFO power to progress.

    BFTracker says scout rifles are equal 'most used' but lowest in kills. This does not surprise me for the reasons above.
  • Removed11322
    730 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Hey, how about getting on the flag and shooting outwards instead of camping way outside where you get spoon fed easy targets on objectives.
    Or is that too risky for you?
  • JacquesVabres
    249 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    DICE loves snipers/scout in bf1. Never see a battlefield infested of snipers as battlefield 1
  • MarxistDictator
    4215 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    edited January 11
    Why do people keep comparing all kit weapons to this game's scout? Obviously having assault rifles would make for easier gameplay but it also removes all the class distinction from the game.

    And relative to other battlefields the Scout rifles are mega buffed, fighting mega nerfed versions of other classes. How people think this isn't the case is beyond me.

    Can you hop on BF4 and blast someone with a single shot to the chest while he tapfires his AR on you? No.

    Here you can in BF1, while surviving 6 .303 rounds from a Lewis to the chest, while said Lewis has to fight a giant handicap in accuracy terms to where its forced to spray. Or when fighting a medic he can't suppress you and assaults can do little more than spam rockets at a distance back. But no, scout is so weak because he can't run direct CQB as well as assault ;( dice ruined the ttk making BF3.5 what's next choppers and muh assault rifles

    But yeah no sniping is the hardest thing ever because dice made it so you have to aim again (not joking, this complaint is all over the bf_one subreddit).
  • BaronVonGoon
    4455 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    edited January 11
    I'd rather die to someone running with Hellreigel/Automatico than a hill humping scout. The good scouts are rare and highly respectable, you don't see them hill humping. 99.99% of hill humping scouts are awful and they only kill you as a result of luck or auto rotation aim assist. They're so stupid that oftentimes you can flank them and troll them with dynamite, limpet, and melee.

    Hellreigel/Automatico guy runs a similar playstyle as me so dying to him is perfectly fine because it tells me that I did something wrong.

    Scout is the red headed step child of Battlefield.
  • theONEFORCE
    2598 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Why do people keep comparing all kit weapons to this game's scout? Obviously having assault rifles would make for easier gameplay but it also removes all the class distinction from the game.

    And relative to other battlefields the Scout rifles are mega buffed, fighting mega nerfed versions of other classes. How people think this isn't the case is beyond me.

    Can you hop on BF4 and blast someone with a single shot to the chest while he tapfires his AR on you? No.

    Here you can in BF1, while surviving 6 .303 rounds from a Lewis to the chest, while said Lewis has to fight a giant handicap in accuracy terms to where its forced to spray. Or when fighting a medic he can't suppress you and assaults can do little more than spam rockets at a distance back. But no, scout is so weak because he can't run direct CQB as well as assault ;( dice ruined the ttk making BF3.5 what's next choppers and muh assault rifles

    But yeah no sniping is the hardest thing ever because dice made it so you have to aim again (not joking, this complaint is all over the bf_one subreddit).

    This is so simple to understand that I feel like I'm being trolled by those who don't agree with it. Like people arguing that they sky isn't blue to make me go insane.
  • Connex_fr
    21 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Meh. Using scouts has never been easier in battlefield games.

    -Bullet velocities are much higher (making it much easier to hit targets without accounting for range/bullet drop).
    -Side arms are much more effective
    -Minimum Damage is much higher (80 vs 55)

    On top of that we have the brand new mechanic of a sweet spot.

    So, no, i dont care that scout is not getting a buff. In fact, I'd still be fine with all scouts sweet spot being nerfed on top of it, because seriously, git gud.

    And yet the most skilless class is getting buffed.

    Not at all, as the most skilless class in BF1 is scout. I've used all classes with many many different weapons. Sniping is way too easy in BF1 and a complete game breaker :
    - they constanly killsteal
    - you get hurt and hide behind some low abstacles, a scout kills you
    - you eventually end up approaching a tank unseen, a scout kills you
    - ... there are sooooo many examples like these !!!

    No, believe me when I say I won't cry for all those guys who just want an easy victory/points farm.

  • llPhantom_Limbll
    3347 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    edited January 11
    Connex_fr wrote: »
    Meh. Using scouts has never been easier in battlefield games.

    -Bullet velocities are much higher (making it much easier to hit targets without accounting for range/bullet drop).
    -Side arms are much more effective
    -Minimum Damage is much higher (80 vs 55)

    On top of that we have the brand new mechanic of a sweet spot.

    So, no, i dont care that scout is not getting a buff. In fact, I'd still be fine with all scouts sweet spot being nerfed on top of it, because seriously, git gud.

    And yet the most skilless class is getting buffed.

    Not at all, as the most skilless class in BF1 is scout. I've used all classes with many many different weapons. Sniping is way too easy in BF1 and a complete game breaker :
    - they constanly killsteal
    - you get hurt and hide behind some low abstacles, a scout kills you
    - you eventually end up approaching a tank unseen, a scout kills you
    - ... there are sooooo many examples like these !!!

    No, believe me when I say I won't cry for all those guys who just want an easy victory/points farm.

    Before you say anything else I encourage you to check some game stats to see which weapons are accumulating the most amount of kills and which class is currently the most popular. Stats never lie.
  • obisearch
    682 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Connex_fr wrote: »
    Meh. Using scouts has never been easier in battlefield games.

    -Bullet velocities are much higher (making it much easier to hit targets without accounting for range/bullet drop).
    -Side arms are much more effective
    -Minimum Damage is much higher (80 vs 55)

    On top of that we have the brand new mechanic of a sweet spot.

    So, no, i dont care that scout is not getting a buff. In fact, I'd still be fine with all scouts sweet spot being nerfed on top of it, because seriously, git gud.

    And yet the most skilless class is getting buffed.

    Not at all, as the most skilless class in BF1 is scout. I've used all classes with many many different weapons. Sniping is way too easy in BF1 and a complete game breaker :
    - they constanly killsteal
    - you get hurt and hide behind some low abstacles, a scout kills you
    - you eventually end up approaching a tank unseen, a scout kills you
    - ... there are sooooo many examples like these !!!

    No, believe me when I say I won't cry for all those guys who just want an easy victory/points farm.

    Delusional drivel. So your telling me it's easier to snipe than run around with a hellreigel, bar storm or fedrov?


    Or actually is this more to do with salt experience from sniper's, after you did mention you find it the easiest yet all you description is how you get robbed by them.
  • IllIllIII
    4218 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Connex_fr wrote: »
    Meh. Using scouts has never been easier in battlefield games.

    -Bullet velocities are much higher (making it much easier to hit targets without accounting for range/bullet drop).
    -Side arms are much more effective
    -Minimum Damage is much higher (80 vs 55)

    On top of that we have the brand new mechanic of a sweet spot.

    So, no, i dont care that scout is not getting a buff. In fact, I'd still be fine with all scouts sweet spot being nerfed on top of it, because seriously, git gud.

    And yet the most skilless class is getting buffed.

    Not at all, as the most skilless class in BF1 is scout. I've used all classes with many many different weapons. Sniping is way too easy in BF1 and a complete game breaker :
    - they constanly killsteal
    - you get hurt and hide behind some low abstacles, a scout kills you
    - you eventually end up approaching a tank unseen, a scout kills you
    - ... there are sooooo many examples like these !!!

    No, believe me when I say I won't cry for all those guys who just want an easy victory/points farm.

    And this is why i like BTR so much!
    It just showed me that your worst class is scout :D
  • xxDicemanxx
    414 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Two things that are new to scout/recon (meaning they weren't in BF3 or BF4):
    -One shot kill sweet spot
    -Auto Rotation aim assist (console)

    Which class benefits the most from gaining such crutches?

    Bf4 had a one shot kill in between 12.5 meters (most people used defensive perk to stop this) and auto rotation if you used iron sights
  • von_Campenstein
    4989 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Hey, how about getting on the flag and shooting outwards instead of camping way outside where you get spoon fed easy targets on objectives.
    Or is that too risky for you?

    Being on the flag many times mean being hit by mortars and planes, not helping the sniping ability, remaining just off the flag to provide cover for the people on the flag getting counterattacked is often more effective, to the detriment of the Scouts overall score.
  • Removed11322
    730 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Hey, how about getting on the flag and shooting outwards instead of camping way outside where you get spoon fed easy targets on objectives.
    Or is that too risky for you?

    Being on the flag many times mean being hit by mortars and planes, not helping the sniping ability, remaining just off the flag to provide cover for the people on the flag getting counterattacked is often more effective, to the detriment of the Scouts overall score.

    Being "just off the flag" is fine.
    I don't know about everyone else's experience but I'll probably see 5 Scouts near or on flags in 4 hours of gameplay. I'm actually surprised when I find one behaving like that.
    For the most part, they are miles from flags, sitting in spawn or on some other useless, well known perch in such large numbers that I'll bounce around squads looking for a well mixed bunch rather than at least 3/5 playing playing Scout.
    How about maybe trialling a game mode where squads are fixed to defined numbers for each class and see how it plays out?
  • cvnoz
    101 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Iam ushally close to flags when playing scout.
  • IllIllIII
    4218 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    cvnoz wrote: »
    Iam ushally close to flags when playing scout.

    Lovely weapon, the MH-sniper.
    I prefer to be a little bit closer to the flag tho ;)

  • obisearch
    682 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    See what I mean, master race aggro sniper. Dice please nerf even harder than your already going to do.

    Great bids btw. I'lload my aggressive lebeling infantry in a bit ;)
  • -Bl1tzTurk-
    392 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    I am a pretty skilled scout player and i must say that its not the easiest job in the world. Especially when you face a parabellum in a radius of 50 to 100 meters for example.

    A scout must hit with his first shot when he faces a enemy with automatic rifle otherwise he is done.

    The question is how hard is it to aim and hit within a hundreth of a second. And dont forget 9 of 10 times you have to pull your pistol out after you hit with sniper. Agains beginners you do this easy but agains skilled players believe me its tough..

    So you basicly complain about a player that trained hard for his speed and accuracy.
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