TTK 2.0 is live!!

Comments

  • theONEFORCE
    2685 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    GrizzGolf wrote: »
    I'm starting to get nervous. I don't want these weapons to ever feel like COD weapons

    LoL, this will still be one of the lowest TTK battlefield games. Several guns are getting one less bullet to kill. Don’t get caught up in the hysteria.

    Still dreaming of bf3.5, aren't ya?

    I have about two hours in BF3 so the game has no relevance to me if that's what you're getting at.
  • theONEFORCE
    2685 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    Sixclicks wrote: »
    I still don't see how an RSC isn't a replacement for an aggressive scout playing under 70 meters. Maybe not a replacement in all aspects, but certainly in terms of effectiveness and playstyle.

    It's a 2 hit kill just like every single scout rifle unless you stick to your sweetspot. I'll take the gun that allows me to play at close range, medium range, and long range that kills twice as fast as pretty much any scout rifle outside of their sweetspot. It's way more versatile.

    What else is there? Headshots? Yeah, scout rifles are better when it comes to headshots. But since the majority of combat leads to body shots - I'll take the rifle that kills faster with body shots at any range below 70 meters. Not to mention that 70 meter 2 hit kill is to literally any part of the body. Who cares about precision when you can 2 shot them to the toe?

    What else? Scout rifles do high damage. Yes, this is helpful if the enemy is already injured or you have another player teamshooting with you. But again, I'll take the weapon that kills faster with body shots against a full health target. I'd rather be more self-sufficient than relying on a teammate to assist or getting lucky that the enemy is already injured.

    What negatives does the RSC have in comparison? Spread - pretty neglibile when you stand still to take your shot just like a scout and aim for center mass. The fire rate is slow enough that it really doesn't seem to build up a ton of spread. Plus its spread is also being reduced. Also, recoil - once again not too significant since the slow fire rate gives you plenty of time to recover your point of aim. Recoil is also being reduced for this gun.

    The RSC is a lot more versatile and easy to use. While the scout is relegated to only being effective when going for headshots, when sticking to their sweetspot range, or when firing at an already injured enemy. The playstyle isn't too different other than never needing to swap to your pistol unless there are more than 2 or 3 enemies. It still allows for the same pop out of cover and take a couple of shots from a distance playstyle. It still requires a good amount of positional awareness. Plus it can take out target in just over 300 ms at close range too.

    So what am I missing?

    I'm not ignoring any of the scout's advantages - they're just not as generally useful.

    You lose the assist counts as kill.

    And instead get kill counts as kill.

    Not if you don't get the second shot. He was saying that he was better off with the RSC because it took two shots anyway if you bothered reading what I was responding too. I suppose that since you guys are the sniper elite of this forum that you don't miss shots. My bad.
  • llPhantom_Limbll
    3735 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    GrizzGolf wrote: »
    I'm starting to get nervous. I don't want these weapons to ever feel like COD weapons

    LoL, this will still be one of the lowest TTK battlefield games. Several guns are getting one less bullet to kill. Don’t get caught up in the hysteria.

    Still dreaming of bf3.5, aren't ya?

    I have about two hours in BF3 so the game has no relevance to me if that's what you're getting at.

    Nah, bf3.5 is the game which came after bf3 but wasn't much of a difference and probably just a poor child of EA greed. But apparently there are lots of "bf veterans" who want every single battlefield game to be exactly like that abomination. Those were the people forcing ttk changes and all other bs around. Even though bf1 is way different from that game and shouldn't even be compared to it. Goo figure.
  • Loqtrall
    11159 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    Sixclicks wrote: »
    I still don't see how an RSC isn't a replacement for an aggressive scout playing under 70 meters. Maybe not a replacement in all aspects, but certainly in terms of effectiveness and playstyle.

    It's a 2 hit kill just like every single scout rifle unless you stick to your sweetspot. I'll take the gun that allows me to play at close range, medium range, and long range that kills twice as fast as pretty much any scout rifle outside of their sweetspot. It's way more versatile.

    What else is there? Headshots? Yeah, scout rifles are better when it comes to headshots. But since the majority of combat leads to body shots - I'll take the rifle that kills faster with body shots at any range below 70 meters. Not to mention that 70 meter 2 hit kill is to literally any part of the body. Who cares about precision when you can 2 shot them to the toe?

    What else? Scout rifles do high damage. Yes, this is helpful if the enemy is already injured or you have another player teamshooting with you. But again, I'll take the weapon that kills faster with body shots against a full health target. I'd rather be more self-sufficient than relying on a teammate to assist or getting lucky that the enemy is already injured.

    What negatives does the RSC have in comparison? Spread - pretty neglibile when you stand still to take your shot just like a scout and aim for center mass. The fire rate is slow enough that it really doesn't seem to build up a ton of spread. Plus its spread is also being reduced. Also, recoil - once again not too significant since the slow fire rate gives you plenty of time to recover your point of aim. Recoil is also being reduced for this gun.

    The RSC is a lot more versatile and easy to use. While the scout is relegated to only being effective when going for headshots, when sticking to their sweetspot range, or when firing at an already injured enemy. The playstyle isn't too different other than never needing to swap to your pistol unless there are more than 2 or 3 enemies. It still allows for the same pop out of cover and take a couple of shots from a distance playstyle. It still requires a good amount of positional awareness. Plus it can take out target in just over 300 ms at close range too.

    So what am I missing?

    I'm not ignoring any of the scout's advantages - they're just not as generally useful.

    You lose the assist counts as kill.

    And instead get kill counts as kill.

    Not if you don't get the second shot. He was saying that he was better off with the RSC because it took two shots anyway if you bothered reading what I was responding too. I suppose that since you guys are the sniper elite of this forum that you don't miss shots. My bad.

    Lol the RSC is getting a RoF buff. If there were a situation where you got an assist counts as kill as Scout because you couldn't get off that second shot before the enemy got into cover - I guarantee 9 times out of 10 you could get the 2nd shot with the RSC.

    That's why I abandoned Scout and have mained Medic since the weapon was even announced to be added to the game. It's a like walking around in cqb with a semi-auto Scout rifle, that now has a higher RoF and 2hk range of 70m.
  • trip1ex
    3503 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    feels like the same game after 4-5 rounds in CTE. kill a tad quicker I guess. probably will notice it more over time. get used to things like not having to reload weapons with smaller mags as often.
  • Zooboid
    850 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    edited January 13
    Played one round on CTE didn't notice much difference in TTK, then went on retail and the TTK ME felt like it had been speeded up for some of the players. EU servers seem to be acting strange to me at least.
  • x_Undaunted_x
    3725 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Zooboid wrote: »
    Played one round on CTE didn't notice much difference in TTK, then went on retail and the TTK ME felt like it had been speeded up for some of the players. EU servers seem to be acting strange to me at least.

    Not sure what you mean. The new TTK meta hasn't dropped to retail yet.
  • TehDukeOfNukem
    519 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Sixclicks wrote: »
    I still don't see how an RSC isn't a replacement for an aggressive scout playing under 70 meters. Maybe not a replacement in all aspects, but certainly in terms of effectiveness and playstyle.

    It's a 2 hit kill just like every single scout rifle unless you stick to your sweetspot. I'll take the gun that allows me to play at close range, medium range, and long range that kills twice as fast as pretty much any scout rifle outside of their sweetspot. It's way more versatile.

    What else is there? Headshots? Yeah, scout rifles are better when it comes to headshots. But since the majority of combat leads to body shots - I'll take the rifle that kills faster with body shots at any range below 70 meters. Not to mention that 70 meter 2 hit kill is to literally any part of the body. Who cares about precision when you can 2 shot them to the toe?

    What else? Scout rifles do high damage. Yes, this is helpful if the enemy is already injured or you have another player teamshooting with you. But again, I'll take the weapon that kills faster with body shots against a full health target. I'd rather be more self-sufficient than relying on a teammate to assist or getting lucky that the enemy is already injured.

    What negatives does the RSC have in comparison? Spread - pretty neglibile when you stand still to take your shot just like a scout and aim for center mass. The fire rate is slow enough that it really doesn't seem to build up a ton of spread. Plus its spread is also being reduced. Also, recoil - once again not too significant since the slow fire rate gives you plenty of time to recover your point of aim. Recoil is also being reduced for this gun.

    The RSC is a lot more versatile and easy to use. While the scout is relegated to only being effective when going for headshots, when sticking to their sweetspot range, or when firing at an already injured enemy. The playstyle isn't too different other than never needing to swap to your pistol unless there are more than 2 or 3 enemies. It still allows for the same pop out of cover and take a couple of shots from a distance playstyle. It still requires a good amount of positional awareness. Plus it can take out target in just over 300 ms at close range too.

    So what am I missing?

    I'm not ignoring any of the scout's advantages - they're just not as generally useful.

    The fact that, depending on which rifle you pick (between the obvious choices of Vetterli, Arisaka, Martini and SMLE) you're getting OHKs to the body for about half of that 0-70m range. Oh, and for 17m and in you have a pocket hand cannon that stomps the RSC in the one range that it should be flat superior.

    Oh and the perfect accuracy combined with Headshot capability, but I guess that's not an advantage unless you're some neck beard who can actually aim their gun (LMAO what is this some kinda FPS?). Hell even if you can't aim you get the benefit of sniper bullet insta suppression that's gonna render the already not very accurate and heavy recoiling RSC into an unusable mess (while you're basically immune to suppression and medic can't output it anyway).

    But no gaise muh ptfo scout is ded

  • MarxistDictator
    4282 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Medic guns are easier to land follow up shots with because they have to land more hits. Didn't know this needed to be elaborated on.

    I guess if we reduce scout to trying to be a bad medic and not utilizing any of the shorter ranged sweet spot rifles yes the RSC is better at flatly 2 hit killing inside 70m.

    Since that is the strength of that as a medic rifle vs the other lower recoiling/lower damaging/much faster firing medic rifles. And if it wasn't better at 2 hit killing than a scout rifle it would be terrible.

    But there are so many advantages to the Scout rifle, even outside close range where it shouldn't be good, that reducing them all to 'muh ptfo range' it's getting pretty clear who the ignorant and selfish players are. Especially the grass is green scout camp that can claim everyone is suddenly going to hit 100% of shots with instant reaction time ignoring all suppression. On a gun with 2.0 horizontal recoil or more depending on the balance used. And on the RSC a missed shot is already basically the TTK of a bolt gun working the second shot, but it is always better for taking 2 hits always but shooting faster.

    Scouts have a godly niche they can't be challenged in, and even a number of tools and unique primary guns that allow him to close the gap and still be effective. And again, one of the top 10 CQB guns in the game, as a secondary.

    All of this is a wash because they're adjusting the balance to make the Huot not lose 1v1 to mostly everything despite being a small magazine automatic rifle. And other garbage guns people do not use, except when people lament how not useful they feel vs other guns at which point they're bombarded with stupid memes about getting good and salt. Or how certain guns are apparently designed to not win gunfights but just sideline spectate and shoot people in the back, even though no gun can fail in that situation.
  • unctheels
    104 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    TEKNOCODE wrote: »
    Honestly when I started playing the game on release I thought bar was king, now I personally think it's trash lol. About everything in the support class is a better option in my opinion.
    Not a fan of the bar either.

    i love the BAR! its my favorite support weapon!
  • unctheels
    104 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    It's pretty strange to go messing with the ttk this late in the game's life cycle in my opinion. The people who like the game and play it regularly, AKA the core community, have had more than enough time to move onto other games if they don't like how this one plays so obviously they're used to the current system and enjoy it as is. The people who don't like the way the game is, have already stopped playing and it's not likely this new re balancing will bring them back for very long. I mean from what I have seen, the main people pushing for this are the "BF4 was better" crowd and they can always go back to BF4 in the off chance they haven't already done so by now.


    I think it's EA pushing for DICE to make the game sexy, make it possible to go on faster multikill sprees which the youtubers then can show people bringing in new customers all thinking they'll be on the dishing end of that.

    nah, a slightly lower TTK will just make the game more fun to most players. thats all.
  • Shidokanartist
    196 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Medic guns are easier to land follow up shots with because they have to land more hits. Didn't know this needed to be elaborated on.

    I guess if we reduce scout to trying to be a bad medic and not utilizing any of the shorter ranged sweet spot rifles yes the RSC is better at flatly 2 hit killing inside 70m.

    Since that is the strength of that as a medic rifle vs the other lower recoiling/lower damaging/much faster firing medic rifles. And if it wasn't better at 2 hit killing than a scout rifle it would be terrible.

    But there are so many advantages to the Scout rifle, even outside close range where it shouldn't be good, that reducing them all to 'muh ptfo range' it's getting pretty clear who the ignorant and selfish players are. Especially the grass is green scout camp that can claim everyone is suddenly going to hit 100% of shots with instant reaction time ignoring all suppression. On a gun with 2.0 horizontal recoil or more depending on the balance used. And on the RSC a missed shot is already basically the TTK of a bolt gun working the second shot, but it is always better for taking 2 hits always but shooting faster.

    Scouts have a godly niche they can't be challenged in, and even a number of tools and unique primary guns that allow him to close the gap and still be effective. And again, one of the top 10 CQB guns in the game, as a secondary.

    All of this is a wash because they're adjusting the balance to make the Huot not lose 1v1 to mostly everything despite being a small magazine automatic rifle. And other garbage guns people do not use, except when people lament how not useful they feel vs other guns at which point they're bombarded with stupid memes about getting good and salt. Or how certain guns are apparently designed to not win gunfights but just sideline spectate and shoot people in the back, even though no gun can fail in that situation.
    TL;DR all guns are perfectly balanced and in the right hands they have the capacity to beat even the Hellriegel.
  • unctheels
    104 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    just played on CTE for a while and the patch is everything i had hoped for! i think this patch will take the fun factor in BF1 to new heights! much more smooth and fluid gunplay imo.
  • Loqtrall
    11159 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    That's why I abandoned Scout

    You sure you didn’t abandon it because of the aim assist nerf?

    Totally

    giphy_2.gif
  • boutneus
    2373 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    So high level discussions around here. All I know is I’ve got service stars on all guns just so I could figure out the best load outs (4 me personally) and here DICE is throwing a monkey wrench in gameplay 1+ yr later. There’s no way I’m gonna go through the trouble again of figuring out which guns suit me best now.
    Sticking to vehicle play or popping in something else
  • obisearch
    682 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    I guess if we reduce scout to trying to be a bad medic and not utilizing any of the shorter ranged sweet spot rifles yes the RSC is better at flatly 2 hit killing inside 70m.

    Since that is the strength of that as a medic rifle vs the other lower recoiling/lower damaging/much faster firing medic rifles. And if it wasn't better at 2 hit killing than a scout rifle it would be terrible.

    But there are so many advantages to the Scout rifle, even outside close range where it shouldn't be good, that reducing them all to 'muh ptfo range' it's getting pretty clear who the ignorant and selfish players are. Especially the grass is green scout camp that can claim everyone is suddenly going to hit 100% of shots with instant reaction time ignoring all suppression.

    Lmao, that's the worst attempt at reverse psychology I've ever seen.

    - make the most obnoxious gun even more obnoxious with reduced btk : check
    - release Pandora's box for scouts allowing the med skill cannons kept down by range into an obvious choice over the any range SLR which becomes almost obsolete: check
    - make support bullet spammers deadly : check
    - encourage scouts to be more relevant in support objective play: wait hold on a sec, let's not go nuts, selfish thinking like that would ruin the game.... I mean scouts have the advantage of pin point accuracy here suppresive free and pistol that can't now compete with the 4btk sack gun, they have enough...

    Funniest thing is everyone hates a hill humper. But yet we support an update that forces them hillside, where does the logic lie?
    If we're hell bent on these dangerous changes then one simple thing can be done for scouts... Make scout exclusive pistols more viable. For cannons like bordeo and mars, reduce spread and allow us to fire it more rapidly accurately like the Slrs. For the lower damage models like frommer, up the btk to four shouts. After all the reigell will murder you in 4 at 650rpm, but a less ROF frommer to 4... Now that's just crazy selfish talk...

  • Huntbang
    138 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    as long as its not like cod where you die as soon as you get touched its fine.
  • theONEFORCE
    2685 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    obisearch wrote: »
    I guess if we reduce scout to trying to be a bad medic and not utilizing any of the shorter ranged sweet spot rifles yes the RSC is better at flatly 2 hit killing inside 70m.

    Since that is the strength of that as a medic rifle vs the other lower recoiling/lower damaging/much faster firing medic rifles. And if it wasn't better at 2 hit killing than a scout rifle it would be terrible.

    But there are so many advantages to the Scout rifle, even outside close range where it shouldn't be good, that reducing them all to 'muh ptfo range' it's getting pretty clear who the ignorant and selfish players are. Especially the grass is green scout camp that can claim everyone is suddenly going to hit 100% of shots with instant reaction time ignoring all suppression.

    Lmao, that's the worst attempt at reverse psychology I've ever seen.

    - make the most obnoxious gun even more obnoxious with reduced btk : check
    - release Pandora's box for scouts allowing the med skill cannons kept down by range into an obvious choice over the any range SLR which becomes almost obsolete: check
    - make support bullet spammers deadly : check
    - encourage scouts to be more relevant in support objective play: wait hold on a sec, let's not go nuts, selfish thinking like that would ruin the game.... I mean scouts have the advantage of pin point accuracy here suppresive free and pistol that can't now compete with the 4btk sack gun, they have enough...

    Funniest thing is everyone hates a hill humper. But yet we support an update that forces them hillside, where does the logic lie?
    If we're hell bent on these dangerous changes then one simple thing can be done for scouts... Make scout exclusive pistols more viable. For cannons like bordeo and mars, reduce spread and allow us to fire it more rapidly accurately like the Slrs. For the lower damage models like frommer, up the btk to four shouts. After all the reigell will murder you in 4 at 650rpm, but a less ROF frommer to 4... Now that's just crazy selfish talk...

    Nothing forces them hillside, they're already there.
  • MarxistDictator
    4282 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    I like how assault/support/medic guns that can't even play the close/medium range game they're supposed to excel at are fine balance wise but making it so they don't lose to all pistols breaks the game balance.

    Its also very convenient for everyone to ignore the tools scout does have on the premise that he isn't as effective 1v1 as another class actually designed for close range. We keep mentioning the fact that the Bodeo will still kill faster than every BUFFED automatic gun but 1, and for 17m (5m longer than this new 4 hit meta is for concerning SMGs). Flares also still exist, along with a bevy of close range oriented rifles that will continue to allow him to close the gap and run with the rest of the squad.

    But yeah, scout cannot be played here.

    He also heads for the hills regardless since the majority of players play classes for the roles they were designed for. Not many throw it out of context but scout literally has 100 times more tools for breaking the mold than any other class has. To say none of this matters because you can't brute force 1v1 classes designed for that range and little else is a joke. The fabled ptfo scout gets lots of love from dice, but apparently that isn't enough without all kit automatic weapons also available.

    No medic/support/assault gun that sucks in close range also dominates long range. In fact the majority of ones that are bad up close continue to be bad everywhere else. Especially when we're talking about SMGs that can't even beat pistols or automatic rifles with small magazines slow fire rates and terrible damage all at once. How is this balance better for the game? None of the assault/medic/support guns are even really viable at 100m, but people think scout should have it all.

    Also the Frommer is already a 4 hit kill, that range is just short. As short as the range of the Hellriegel 4 hit kill in new balance. Since you're already not aware the Frommer can even do this with that same damage I'm going to say it's not as relevant anymore. Especially since the Hellriegel has the same 5/6 shot range it has now, only far more recoil. In the grand scheme of new TTK it's less desirable there than it is now, but this has been explained with many guns already and people just continue to be ignorant.

    Like the buffed BAR, it is not the only support weapon and to even think that is just childish and glossing over the many desirable traits of other LMGs that are highlighted by them also packing good damage output. Obviously for some balance to remain the BAR needs to have a DPS advantage otherwise the negatives outweigh the positives, since it has almost no sustained damage vs the others and no bipod on its cqb loadouts.
This discussion has been closed.