Is finally sniper the most played class according to stats? Stat link inside

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  • stiII_no_name
    540 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Hawxxeye wrote: »
    Hawxxeye wrote: »
    To those who think that a scout can only be selfish and offer less to the team than other classes I present you:
    The Flare guy!
    A scout who uses the flare gun at every possible opportunity can give incredible advantage to his team as well as rack a lot of spot points. Seriously the only reason that my scout level is higher than the other 3 classes is due to flare related bonus points (spot assists, flare spot assists, flare damage, flare kills).

    I like agressive scouts. When I play scout, I am always on the objective. And always use flares. And trip wires. I loooove running to a contested point, throw a flame nade onto a group of enemies, walk into the fire and plant a tripwire. Certain doom for me and them :D
    And any flare gun kills bring a lot of laugh as well.

    How many kills do you guys have with it? I'm at 87 rn

    444 combined, that flash flare needs a serious buff!

    Triple
    Ploodovic wrote: »
    Hawxxeye wrote: »
    Hawxxeye wrote: »
    To those who think that a scout can only be selfish and offer less to the team than other classes I present you:
    The Flare guy!
    A scout who uses the flare gun at every possible opportunity can give incredible advantage to his team as well as rack a lot of spot points. Seriously the only reason that my scout level is higher than the other 3 classes is due to flare related bonus points (spot assists, flare spot assists, flare damage, flare kills).

    I like agressive scouts. When I play scout, I am always on the objective. And always use flares. And trip wires. I loooove running to a contested point, throw a flame nade onto a group of enemies, walk into the fire and plant a tripwire. Certain doom for me and them :D
    And any flare gun kills bring a lot of laugh as well.

    How many kills do you guys have with it? I'm at 87 rn

    627. I’d say 95% of them are accidental. But it’s also good for flushing out corner campers.

    OMG, haha :dizzy:

    Is there something better than shooting a flare in a hallway and getting hitmarkers for what feels like a whole minute?
  • Sixclicks
    5075 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited April 2018
    ****
    Sixclicks wrote: »
    Camping scouts were worse in previous BF games where they sat 500+ meters away from the objectives with their 20x and 40x scopes. Although there were less of them since recon was a highly ineffective class in most cases since assault was such an easy-button class that there wasn't too many reasons to play other classes. The more reasonable bullet velocities and sweetspots of BF1 have finally made scouts a decently balanced class relative to the others. Which naturally means there's more scouts than before, and they're also more noticeable since they can actually make an impact on the game now.

    I still say a good chunk of the recent increase was due to the scout community mission, however I could also see the increase as a result of TTK2 encouraging a more passive playstyle amongst the community - which naturally the scout class is one of the best at passive playstyles.

    They still sit way back with scopes, but now with the major buff to the rifles and the usuall red dot to aim for it is easier to hit people, and there is way more. In Bf4 there where like a few maps that were really infested, here thanks to the buffs, it is every kind of open map. Obviously the real farm thing is to try and hang back in sweetspot now, but even without a sweetspot obviously thanks to increased velocity and with the very low drop a hs have probably never have been easier in Bf. What I for my life cant understand is how useless most of the snipers are. Lets just look at that snipe walkway on Ballroom that DICE made with ladders to get up to. How anyone can stand up there without being instantly shoot is fantastic, each side can be seen from half the map on CQ.

    I tried scout a little but it really cramps my playstyle (Or rather it bores me, if you are on a team that don´t cap...), it is an easy 3-1 kd without even training (Well, except map knowledge and play patterns, just knowing where the nice firing lanes are is really helpfull, trust me, most scouts do it way wrong.), I just take way to quick shoots instead of aiming. So for me it was just hanging back taking cheapshots on people (Duh.), on Scar I noticed that my favorite places to just hang was not really the places where I see snipers, because they are so into standing ontop of some bloody hill or in a window. Not to mention how easy it is on dark maps to just farm people in the dark, you fire, you die....

    I think I just made a few headshots, while most kills were simply sweetspots or two hits, or just hitting someone already wounded. How anyone could go negative while playing scout the hang back a bit style is just amazing. Anyone rushing in better close the distances quickly so that you are in pistol range, because the pistols in this game can still beat most other weapons in really close ranges.


    I mostly go for headshot when sniping from a distance and rarely benefit from sweetspots except with some specific rifles like the Vetterli or Martini-Henry or Arisaka. I used to play very aggressively before TTK2, but I just don't feel it's generally worth it anymore. So I play what I call semi-aggressively - still moving from objective to objective, but rather than pushing into the objective with my team I sit just outside of it and try to prevent enemies from getting to it or try to take out enemies on the objective. While also providing spotting and flare support. When the enemy is down to a more manageable number, then I'll move in. Some pistols, particularly the Bodeo, can be strong in close range, but it's still generally best to just avoid encounters in those ranges as a scout. Else a SMG 08/18 will melt you in 0.23 seconds.

    Getting a high KDR as a scout may be easy, but getting a high KDR, SPM, and KPM as a scout is more difficult relative to the other classes.

    As for muzzle velocity, the differences really aren't that huge between BF4 and BF1. The amount of extra distance that you need to lead a target in BF4 compared to BF1 is only about 10-15%.* And beyond 300 meters, BF1 bullets actually travel slower than BF4 bullets due to the addition of the air drag mechanic.

    *Correction: The difference depends a lot on range and the rifle you're using. I did a calculation using the fastest velocity bolt action rifle from BF4 compared to the fastest velocity bolt action rifle from BF1. The following is if you don't consider drag at all.

    M98B - 650 m/s
    G98 - 880 m/s

    I'm just assuming a soldier moves at 5 mph for this calculation. No idea what it actually is, but this is just for example purposes. The soldier is moving perpendicular to you as you shoot.

    At a 100 meter distance with the M98B you'd have to lead your target by about 0.35 meters to get a perfect center mass hit. With the G98 you'd have to lead your target by about 0.25 meters at the same range for a perfect center mass hit. That's about a 40% difference. Although relative to your location, that distance is hardly noticeable since it's only a small adjustment in your point of aim. In fact, you'd only need to adjust by 0.057 degrees at that range to make up the difference.

    Also, a soldier is wider than a single point in space, so you'd have something more like a range of 0.2275 - 0.4725 meters for the M98B and 0.1275 - 0.3725 meters for the G98 based on an average human width from the side while standing straight of 9.5 inches. As you can see, those numbers overlap a little. Meaning there is actually a point where you could aim between 0.2275 - 0.3725 meters ahead of your target where you'd still get a hit on your target regardless of which of those two rifles you were using.

    And as I said, this is without considering the effects of drag which will reduce the velocity of your bullet in BF1 as it travels.
    Post edited by Sixclicks on
  • FPSgamer69
    395 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Argonne Forrest is a perfect map for scouts and the outer part of Fort de Vaux too. Inside it's not quite as good, but spot flares can also be extremely helpful here.

    I see a lot of scouts in Fort lately
    Argone has lots of cover gladly
  • V2Face
    2688 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited April 2018
    Sitting and camping with a sniper rifle an entire match will definitely make the time played shoot up really high. As mentioned there was a mission a few days ago. SMGs and SLRs account for more general usage
  • Major_Pungspark
    1599 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited April 2018
    Seriously, did someone come in and just say that the stats are wrong, so we are wrong, and he is right with some amazing math error?
  • V2Face
    2688 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Seriously, did someone come in and just say that the stats are wrong, so we are wrong, and he is right?

    Fixed my post

  • Ploodovic
    1642 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    The graph shows that the usage time for rifles, SMGs, and SLRs are evenly distributed. Only the LMGs fall behind a little. I think to have the four main classes be played roughly the same amount, should be a goal of the developers, and would indicate a well balanced class system. Looks like BF1 mostly achieves this.
  • Major_Pungspark
    1599 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    You cant have 25% sniping in any game, thought that was kind of obvious, on the open maps it is 50% at times. Think for bf2018 they should make sniper groups, to have more people playing instead of camping. I can be generous and have four groups with two players each in, then it will never be more than a quarter of the players sniping.
  • Gforce81
    3666 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    You cant have 25% sniping in any game, thought that was kind of obvious, on the open maps it is 50% at times. Think for bf2018 they should make sniper groups, to have more people playing instead of camping. I can be generous and have four groups with two players each in, then it will never be more than a quarter of the players sniping.

    Then I want the same grouping on the future possible "Assault" class, why should long range classes be restricted/grouped, but the class with the most explosive gadgets and generally most aggressive primaries gets out scott free?

    It's an endless circle as soon as you start limiting any classes. Remember that as much as you hate Scout, other players hate the other classes just as much

    If we can't please everyone in the same way, it's better to have everyone pissed off in the same way
  • Major_Pungspark
    1599 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Because this is not sniper elite, but it really plays like it at times. Make a camp class to good, and this is what happens, it is either nerfing them to ground until they give up or having it at an okay level but limiting the numbers. In bf4 they werent that powerful before the superbuff in Bf1 but still every possible building or dam was still covered in them if there was an opportunity to camp and snipe. You could still have 12-13 snipers on Langcang dam or dawnbreaker even though the rifles where not even close to what we got now. Now they are certainly closer most of the time but that is because someone gave them a sweetspot and also the maps are certainly smaller even though it don´t feel like that all the time while doing the zig zag thing to not end up as Rickon. There could be entire rounds of Langcang when you barely saw enemy on foot or just the usuall other squad on the enemy team, but they might have gone a little bit overboard with the number of vehicles on sone maps.
  • stiII_no_name
    540 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    https://battlefieldtracker.com/bf1/insights

    Time spent by weapon type gives us approximately these results:

    Scout rifles: 21%
    Self-loading rifles: 21%
    SMGs: 21%
    LMGs: 16%
    Shotguns: 4%

    --> 83%

    The rest are gadgets, sidearms, grenades, etc. My guess would be that scouts account for a more than average sidearm usage rate, supports for more of the gadgets percentage (mortars, crossbows), therefore the results will include a slide bias, but it should be <10%.

    21/83*100~25% playing medic and scout
    25/83*100~30% playing assault
    16/83*100~19% playing support


    So no, assault is still the most played class, which really shouldn't come as a surprise, lol.


    Quotas for classes? How about no, I want to have the freedom to play the class I want and if I can't because there's one player too much already playing it, I will get mad. But seriously, this balance is really not all that bad, I'm actually surprised by how good it is.

    On the problem with the scouts camping way back, here's an idea:
    How about the headshot bonus drops at a certain distance, let's say 130m (all debateable, doesn't matter all that much now), meaning that at a certain distance, a headshot is not a OHK anymore with a sniper rifle, but they would still deal a fair amount of damage. There are already rifles that aren't OHK over all distances, but that's because their damage drops to <59. This way they could still hit more than 59, but not be OHK at a certain distance to the opponent.

  • Sixclicks
    5075 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited April 2018
    BF1 rifles vs BF4 rifles really aren't that significantly different first of all, other than the addition of the sweetspot mechanic. The difference in the time it takes your bullet to reach your target 100 meters away with the fastest velocity rifle in this game versus BF4 is 0.04 seconds. The extra distance you need to lead your target is negligible.

    Secondly, scout isn't equipped to rush objectives like assault is. Don't blame scout for being a camping class when that's the way it's been designed by DICE. Us scout players have asked for access to more PTFO oriented weapons a lot now just to be met with "that's not your class role." So you dislike scouts because they camp, but also don't want them to have the means to play in a less campy playstyle...

    Scouts weren't as powerful in BF4 because assault was the be all end all class, and scout (recon) was the only class where you were forced to have a significantly higher level of skill to do well with relative to the other classes. It was anything but balanced.

    Now the numbers show that medic and scout are pretty well balanced for the most part while support is still a little weak and assault is still the strongest.
  • von_Campenstein
    6621 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    Because this is not sniper elite, but it really plays like it at times. Make a camp class to good, and this is what happens, it is either nerfing them to ground until they give up or having it at an okay level but limiting the numbers. In bf4 they werent that powerful before the superbuff in Bf1 but still every possible building or dam was still covered in them if there was an opportunity to camp and snipe. You could still have 12-13 snipers on Langcang dam or dawnbreaker even though the rifles where not even close to what we got now. Now they are certainly closer most of the time but that is because someone gave them a sweetspot and also the maps are certainly smaller even though it don´t feel like that all the time while doing the zig zag thing to not end up as Rickon. There could be entire rounds of Langcang when you barely saw enemy on foot or just the usuall other squad on the enemy team, but they might have gone a little bit overboard with the number of vehicles on sone maps.

    Hey man, not everyone wanted to be a distant sniper, DICE LA forced that development.
  • Gforce81
    3666 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Because this is not sniper elite, but it really plays like it at times. Make a camp class to good, and this is what happens, it is either nerfing them to ground until they give up or having it at an okay level but limiting the numbers. In bf4 they werent that powerful before the superbuff in Bf1 but still every possible building or dam was still covered in them if there was an opportunity to camp and snipe. You could still have 12-13 snipers on Langcang dam or dawnbreaker even though the rifles where not even close to what we got now. Now they are certainly closer most of the time but that is because someone gave them a sweetspot and also the maps are certainly smaller even though it don´t feel like that all the time while doing the zig zag thing to not end up as Rickon. There could be entire rounds of Langcang when you barely saw enemy on foot or just the usuall other squad on the enemy team, but they might have gone a little bit overboard with the number of vehicles on sone maps.

    The part of this that you're not grasping is this is completely subjective, entirely based on your opinion. You seem you have a huge chip on your shoulder against scouts in general.

    Not everyone shares in these feelings, it's entirely based on opinions.

    We all should just agree to disagree, because there is no middle ground here. Everyone has their own pet peeves that they would love to see taken down a peg. But it's not gonna happen

  • Sixclicks
    5075 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    I mean, I don't like camping scouts much either, but I accept it because it's the role they've been pushed into. That said, I also hate running into an insta-kill SMG or shotgun around every corner. Maybe we should limit assault too since I don't like them.
  • KarmaKinetic
    1143 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    edited April 2018
    You cant have 25% sniping in any game, thought that was kind of obvious, on the open maps it is 50% at times. Think for bf2018 they should make sniper groups, to have more people playing instead of camping. I can be generous and have four groups with two players each in, then it will never be more than a quarter of the players sniping.

    I would like to see a sniper only game mode. Where all the Hill humpers can do their 1000m headshots to get their sense of fullfillment. And dance around the campfire later, roasting marshmellows, and having Some Apple cider.

    Pun intended, but Im dead serious.
    Either that, or a limit to the scout class.
    Way to Many people camp behind objectives, and just stare at them while they are being capped. “Hey look, a flag, what is it’s purpose?”.

  • von_Campenstein
    6621 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    edited April 2018
    Well that's just like your opinion man.

    Had to post something here because this subpar forum insisted on keeping what I previously posted as a tiresome draft to behold every time I checked the thread.

    Yeah it's gone now, top notch...
  • trip1ex
    5228 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    edited April 2018
    You're supposed to camp as scout.

    But there's always too many. They need to limit them. I'd just make the sniper like a Cav class. And have a few of them on maps and maybe put a few on flags. And then I'd discourage camping the kits on the spawn screen. IF you just played a sniper kit then you wouldn't see the kit respawn until 20 seconds after everyone else.

    Or I'd make the sniper rifle a progression perk that you earn from defending flag pts.
  • KarmaKinetic
    1143 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    trip1ex wrote: »
    You're supposed to camp as scout.

    But there's always too many. They need to limit them. I'd just make the sniper like a Cav class. And have a few of them on maps and maybe put a few on flags. And then I'd discourage camping the kits on the spawn screen. IF you just played a sniper kit then you wouldn't see the kit respawn until 20 seconds after everyone else.

    Or I'd make the sniper rifle a progression perk that you earn from defending flag pts.

    Solid idea! I really like this!
  • Sixclicks
    5075 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited April 2018
    I wouldn't even buy the game if they did that. Scout has been my favorite class for multiple BF titles now. I have the most fun with it. If I joined a match and all the scout kits were taken when I feel like playing scout, I'd just leave.
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