It's a 5.5" drop increase and 43 ms time increase at 150 meters when including drag with 600 m/s versus 700 m/s.
That difference grows to an 11.2" drop and 62 ms increase at 200 meters. And at 250 meters it's 20.5" and 82 ms.
Headshot hitbox is the same as BF4, but the rifles are substantially weaker than BF4 rifles. They're also weaker than BF3 rifles.
The last time rifles were this weak was BFBC2. Based on the K98 alone at least. I'm really hoping there are other much stronger rifles, but I'm doubtful there will be.
Pt still applies if those numbers are correct. 5.5" and 43ms. Should be difficult to pull off 250m sniper shots in this game.
Headshot box is bigger than BF1. And ALL weapons are "substantially" weaker than BF4 weapons using your definition of substantially.
People loved sniper rifles in BFBC2. I sure did.
Sniper rifles are still 2 shots to the body. And 1 to the head.
Yes. Substantially. As in 55 damage starting at 60 meters instead of 59 damage starting at 150 meters. Or 90 damage to 8 meters versus 100 damage to 12.5 meters. Or 2.7x the drop at 100 meters, 3.6x the drop at 200 meters, and 4.7x the drop at 300 meters. That's certainly substantial.
ALL weapons are "substantially" weaker than in BF4. And yet sniper rifles still 2 shots to the body. 1 to the head.
Agree. And i really don't get why people insist on comparing it to previous BF titles. This isn't supposed to be a new version of BF1, BF3, BF4 or any other BF title. it's supposed to be a game in its own right. I get using your experience with other games to evaluate it, and to come with suggestions. But i don't get why people want this game to be like any previous game. And suggestions like "it should be like in BF4" i find to be wrong, but that's just my opinion.
So i think it's a good thing that it's different. It doesn't matter that it's "weaker" than BF4 or any other game, because you are not going to be playing against BF4 in it. you are going to be playing BFV, so stop comparing every weapon to the same type weapons in other games, and compare the weapons to the actual balance of the weapons in this actual game. Which quite frankly i find to be pretty well balanced as of now in BFV. some minor tweaks needed but nothing major.
Every other weapon is closer to BF4/BF3 performance while bolt actions are far from it. That's why I'm using them for comparison.
Compared to the balance of other weapons in this game, bolt actions still suck. Like I've said many times now, it's significantly easier to sit back and snipe with the G43 which isn't affected by glint, is a lot more spammable, is also strong in medium and close ranges, and as a medic you can heal yourself should an enemy sniper land a hit on you anyway.
You are never gonna get through to them
Oh by the way did you see the shotgun in the new trailer? If shotguns are assault only again or heaven forbid all class (or at least Multi class) it may rival out the bolt actions. I wouldn't be surprised if it's centerfire round alt fire is more potent then an actual class's primary weapon (and historically still the more used and issued weapons)
Those people will not stop until assault with fully automatic weapons is the only viable and playable class. They don't need anything else, they don't need to grow skill, they don't need any sort of balancing. It's all about "traaatttttta and everyone on screen is dead".
It's a 5.5" drop increase and 43 ms time increase at 150 meters when including drag with 600 m/s versus 700 m/s.
That difference grows to an 11.2" drop and 62 ms increase at 200 meters. And at 250 meters it's 20.5" and 82 ms.
Headshot hitbox is the same as BF4, but the rifles are substantially weaker than BF4 rifles. They're also weaker than BF3 rifles.
The last time rifles were this weak was BFBC2. Based on the K98 alone at least. I'm really hoping there are other much stronger rifles, but I'm doubtful there will be.
Pt still applies if those numbers are correct. 5.5" and 43ms. Should be difficult to pull off 250m sniper shots in this game.
Headshot box is bigger than BF1. And ALL weapons are "substantially" weaker than BF4 weapons using your definition of substantially.
People loved sniper rifles in BFBC2. I sure did.
Sniper rifles are still 2 shots to the body. And 1 to the head.
Yes. Substantially. As in 55 damage starting at 60 meters instead of 59 damage starting at 150 meters. Or 90 damage to 8 meters versus 100 damage to 12.5 meters. Or 2.7x the drop at 100 meters, 3.6x the drop at 200 meters, and 4.7x the drop at 300 meters. That's certainly substantial.
ALL weapons are "substantially" weaker than in BF4. And yet sniper rifles still 2 shots to the body. 1 to the head.
Agree. And i really don't get why people insist on comparing it to previous BF titles. This isn't supposed to be a new version of BF1, BF3, BF4 or any other BF title. it's supposed to be a game in its own right. I get using your experience with other games to evaluate it, and to come with suggestions. But i don't get why people want this game to be like any previous game. And suggestions like "it should be like in BF4" i find to be wrong, but that's just my opinion.
So i think it's a good thing that it's different. It doesn't matter that it's "weaker" than BF4 or any other game, because you are not going to be playing against BF4 in it. you are going to be playing BFV, so stop comparing every weapon to the same type weapons in other games, and compare the weapons to the actual balance of the weapons in this actual game. Which quite frankly i find to be pretty well balanced as of now in BFV. some minor tweaks needed but nothing major.
Every other weapon is closer to BF4/BF3 performance while bolt actions are far from it. That's why I'm using them for comparison.
Compared to the balance of other weapons in this game, bolt actions still suck. Like I've said many times now, it's significantly easier to sit back and snipe with the G43 which isn't affected by glint, is a lot more spammable, is also strong in medium and close ranges, and as a medic you can heal yourself should an enemy sniper land a hit on you anyway.
You are never gonna get through to them
Oh by the way did you see the shotgun in the new trailer? If shotguns are assault only again or heaven forbid all class (or at least Multi class) it may rival out the bolt actions. I wouldn't be surprised if it's centerfire round alt fire is more potent then an actual class's primary weapon (and historically still the more used and issued weapons)
Those people will not stop until assault with fully automatic weapons is the only viable and playable class. They don't need anything else, they don't need to grow skill, they don't need any sort of balancing. It's all about "traaatttttta and everyone on screen is dead".
The irony of them berating people who play Scout and telling them to shut up and get good aye
personally i prefer more bullet drop and less velocity on snipers. I like the challenge it brings with lining up a perfect shot. I feel like the fun of sniping is taken away when I do not have to worry about leading my target or bullet drop. sniping in bf3/4 was perfect for me.
Sniping in the first closed alpha appeared to be too strong in my opinion, most of the sniping gameplay i watched involved very little leading/ accounting for bullet drop. I'm not sure if the second closed alpha is too much of a nerf or not but it seems to me the lack of health regen will have a big effect on the power of sniping in battlefield so a nerf of sniping from the first closed alpha was needed.
My main class is recon by the way... I love sniping but i hated it in bf1..
Those people will not stop until assault with fully automatic weapons is the only viable and playable class. They don't need anything else, they don't need to grow skill, they don't need any sort of balancing. It's all about "traaatttttta and everyone on screen is dead".
The skill of BF1 sniping? In BF1 play mostly assault because I like to take objectives, sitting on a hill with a laserscope doesnt always add very much to the game.
Which is a problem in BF1, now everyone is running LMGs and Snipers because its almost easier.
As people mentioned earlier, its a support class, but I think mainly map design are problematic in BF1, hoping for a bit different map styles in BF V.
Those people will not stop until assault with fully automatic weapons is the only viable and playable class. They don't need anything else, they don't need to grow skill, they don't need any sort of balancing. It's all about "traaatttttta and everyone on screen is dead".
The skill of BF1 sniping? In BF1 play mostly assault because I like to take objectives, sitting on a hill with a laserscope doesnt always add very much to the game.
Which is a problem in BF1, now everyone is running LMGs and Snipers because its almost easier.
As people mentioned earlier, its a support class, but I think mainly map design are problematic in BF1, hoping for a bit different map styles in BF V.
You can argue as much as you can but sniping at least takes some skill to aim and land your shots. What skill does assault require? Don't even need to ADS. Just spray your smg and get everybody killed or simply OHK them with shotgun. Sure thing such gamestyle is very skillful and very rewarding.
Those people will not stop until assault with fully automatic weapons is the only viable and playable class. They don't need anything else, they don't need to grow skill, they don't need any sort of balancing. It's all about "traaatttttta and everyone on screen is dead".
The skill of BF1 sniping? In BF1 play mostly assault because I like to take objectives, sitting on a hill with a laserscope doesnt always add very much to the game.
Which is a problem in BF1, now everyone is running LMGs and Snipers because its almost easier.
As people mentioned earlier, its a support class, but I think mainly map design are problematic in BF1, hoping for a bit different map styles in BF V.
Thus the problem with BF community certain people see others as supporting them but they themselves refuse to support others. Guess what you can't whine about players not PTFO when you turn others into a supporting role only.
If you really believe Scout is a supporting role then you should have no objection to restricting Assault numbers while making it easier for any one to use Scout, don't you want Assault to be the Star.
Those people will not stop until assault with fully automatic weapons is the only viable and playable class. They don't need anything else, they don't need to grow skill, they don't need any sort of balancing. It's all about "traaatttttta and everyone on screen is dead".
The skill of BF1 sniping? In BF1 play mostly assault because I like to take objectives, sitting on a hill with a laserscope doesnt always add very much to the game.
Which is a problem in BF1, now everyone is running LMGs and Snipers because its almost easier.
As people mentioned earlier, its a support class, but I think mainly map design are problematic in BF1, hoping for a bit different map styles in BF V.
That may be your opinion, but the stats for nearly every player I've ever looked at in BF1 still show that they do worse with the scout class than any other class. The other classes are far easier to PTFO with. As someone who doesn't like to sit on a hill and actually likes to fight for objectives and assist my team, I completely disagree that scout is so easy. They are by far the hardest class to PTFO with. I couldn't care less about hillhumpers. If we had bolt action rifles that were strong in close or medium range relative to the other classes, I wouldn't even complain if their long ranged performance sucked. As it is now in BFV, the G43 is better for all but the longest of ranges. Which only forces the sniper class more into the hillhumper role for the average player.
Which is why I hate the lack of direction DICE has towards the scout class. Low ammo means you need to move into CQB areas to resupply. The flare can only be deployed a very short distance in front of you, meaning you also need to be in CQB areas to assist your team with it. The pistol swap time and ADS time are slower, making it harder to do well in those ranges. There's no extremely close ranged 12.5 meter OHK like BF4 had. Scope glint at close and medium ranges turns you into an instant target - it's a lot like shoot at the orange Dorito, except it's the bright white flashlight shining at you instead. On the other side of the range spectrum, your bullets drop off to 55 damage (51 on a limb hit) at a mere 60 meters, and bullet drop is significantly higher than any BF game in the history of the entire series. You no longer have an exclusive accuracy at long range advantage due to no RBD. And unrelated to the scout class specifically, you can currently automatically regenerate way too much health over way too short of a period of time. It wouldn't be too big of a deal that your bullets only do 55 damage beyond 60 meters if the enemy couldn't get behind cover for 3 seconds and already survive a 2nd shot. It's as if the min damage is balanced as though there was zero automatic health regen, but that's not the case.
And if the class is just meant to be a support role, then the points you receive for spotting the enemy with the spotting scope, spotting with the spotting flare, friendly spawns on your spawn beacon, and assisting your teammates with kills needs to be drastically increased. You can heal or revive one friendly player and score more points than you get from teammates killing 3 or 4 enemies that you've spotted for them while also playing a strong PTFO combat class. Even assist counts as kills are only worth 20 points on top of the damage you did. Playing scout (recon) as a support role in BF4 for example was actually rewarding. I could spend the whole match flying around in the MAV relaying enemy positions to my team and actually score well by doing so thus making my impact on the team effort clear.
Those people will not stop until assault with fully automatic weapons is the only viable and playable class. They don't need anything else, they don't need to grow skill, they don't need any sort of balancing. It's all about "traaatttttta and everyone on screen is dead".
The skill of BF1 sniping? In BF1 play mostly assault because I like to take objectives, sitting on a hill with a laserscope doesnt always add very much to the game.
Which is a problem in BF1, now everyone is running LMGs and Snipers because its almost easier.
As people mentioned earlier, its a support class, but I think mainly map design are problematic in BF1, hoping for a bit different map styles in BF V.
You can argue as much as you can but sniping at least takes some skill to aim and land your shots. What skill does assault require? Don't even need to ADS. Just spray your smg and get everybody killed or simply OHK them with shotgun. Sure thing such gamestyle is very skillful and very rewarding.
I can attest with my over 40 service stars on the MP-18 Trench (a supposedly 'terrible' SMG) that running around as an Assault without even aiming down your sights is much easier than most other playstyles ... you do take some risks, such as people sitting in corners with shotguns, or tanks you didn't expect, or getting caught out in the open, but on a lot of maps, aggressively pushing with an SMG can work absurdly well, and a lot of the time, it isn't even that hard to pull off.
Sniping seems easier because a lot of snipers just sit far away from the objectives. This playstyle has less stress, and allows one to take their time to get a kill, but I can guarantee that a guy pushing with an SMG will get more kills, at a faster rate, and with greater ease. This also works with fast-firing/high DPS LMGs.
For crying out loud, my 'tryhard mode' is either an MP-18 Trench or Support loadout that switches between the Chauchat, BAR, Burton, LMG 08/18 and the Madsen.
The only thing that's really easier with sniping is stacking your KDR, but who cares about that if you're an objective focused player? Your 10 kills and 1 death don't do much for the team. Even if you're scoring 40+ kills... who cares if you're not fighting for the objective? You can easily get that many kills with assault too and be on the objectives.
My "tryhard mode" is just the typical SMG 08/18 or more recently the Burton LMR in BF1. If I need more range I'll use the LMG 08/18. They're so easy to do well with. Otherwise, when I want a more fun and involved gameplay, I use the Vetterli Carbine, Arisaka Patrol, Martini-Henry Infantry, or SMLE Carbine. I flip between those 4 often.
What skill does it take to shoot an Assault troop from 100+m away as a Sniper when they can't even fire back at you? None.
Try constantly landing 100+m shots and we will talk.
lol. It's like shooting fish in a barrel. Don't act like you can't land 100m shot after 100m shot in BF1.
The flinch *is* horrendous. i thought it was some kind of lag/FPS bug. That's what it felt like. Like I'd get hit and suddenly my aim teleports to 20 feet away. Just horrible. And people complained about supporession before. The flinch is 1000% worse.
Those people will not stop until assault with fully automatic weapons is the only viable and playable class. They don't need anything else, they don't need to grow skill, they don't need any sort of balancing. It's all about "traaatttttta and everyone on screen is dead".
The skill of BF1 sniping? In BF1 play mostly assault because I like to take objectives, sitting on a hill with a laserscope doesnt always add very much to the game.
Which is a problem in BF1, now everyone is running LMGs and Snipers because its almost easier.
As people mentioned earlier, its a support class, but I think mainly map design are problematic in BF1, hoping for a bit different map styles in BF V.
You can argue as much as you can but sniping at least takes some skill to aim and land your shots. What skill does assault require? Don't even need to ADS. Just spray your smg and get everybody killed or simply OHK them with shotgun. Sure thing such gamestyle is very skillful and very rewarding.
I can attest with my over 40 service stars on the MP-18 Trench (a supposedly 'terrible' SMG) that running around as an Assault without even aiming down your sights is much easier than most other playstyles ... you do take some risks, such as people sitting in corners with shotguns, or tanks you didn't expect, or getting caught out in the open, but on a lot of maps, aggressively pushing with an SMG can work absurdly well, and a lot of the time, it isn't even that hard to pull off.
Sniping seems easier because a lot of snipers just sit far away from the objectives. This playstyle has less stress, and allows one to take their time to get a kill, but I can guarantee that a guy pushing with an SMG will get more kills, at a faster rate, and with greater ease. This also works with fast-firing/high DPS LMGs.
For crying out loud, my 'tryhard mode' is either an MP-18 Trench or Support loadout that switches between the Chauchat, BAR, Burton, LMG 08/18 and the Madsen.
Case in point. I was going to play Scout; good thing I didn't. Ended the match 48-8 and never once got killed by a Scout on an apparent open map were scouts just "rack up kills"
What skill does it take to shoot an Assault troop from 100+m away as a Sniper when they can't even fire back at you? None.
Obviously some because since beta you can do the Serpentine bunny hop move and avoid being shot by a Scout who is 100m. Even just changing direct of your run in a casual manner can also do the same thing.
How is clicking a mouse with the Scout class any different to clicking the mouse as any other class?
What skill does it take to shoot an Assault troop from 100+m away as a Sniper when they can't even fire back at you? None.
Obviously some because since beta you can do the Serpentine bunny hop move and avoid being shot by a Scout who is 100m. Even just changing direct of your run in a casual manner can also do the same thing.
How is clicking a mouse with the Scout class any different to clicking the mouse as any other class?
Assault can't shoot back at distance. That's how it is different. You're also sitting safely behind your team.
Comments
Those people will not stop until assault with fully automatic weapons is the only viable and playable class. They don't need anything else, they don't need to grow skill, they don't need any sort of balancing. It's all about "traaatttttta and everyone on screen is dead".
The irony of them berating people who play Scout and telling them to shut up and get good aye
Sniping in the first closed alpha appeared to be too strong in my opinion, most of the sniping gameplay i watched involved very little leading/ accounting for bullet drop. I'm not sure if the second closed alpha is too much of a nerf or not but it seems to me the lack of health regen will have a big effect on the power of sniping in battlefield so a nerf of sniping from the first closed alpha was needed.
My main class is recon by the way... I love sniping but i hated it in bf1..
The skill of BF1 sniping? In BF1 play mostly assault because I like to take objectives, sitting on a hill with a laserscope doesnt always add very much to the game.
Which is a problem in BF1, now everyone is running LMGs and Snipers because its almost easier.
As people mentioned earlier, its a support class, but I think mainly map design are problematic in BF1, hoping for a bit different map styles in BF V.
You can argue as much as you can but sniping at least takes some skill to aim and land your shots. What skill does assault require? Don't even need to ADS. Just spray your smg and get everybody killed or simply OHK them with shotgun. Sure thing such gamestyle is very skillful and very rewarding.
If you really believe Scout is a supporting role then you should have no objection to restricting Assault numbers while making it easier for any one to use Scout, don't you want Assault to be the Star.
That may be your opinion, but the stats for nearly every player I've ever looked at in BF1 still show that they do worse with the scout class than any other class. The other classes are far easier to PTFO with. As someone who doesn't like to sit on a hill and actually likes to fight for objectives and assist my team, I completely disagree that scout is so easy. They are by far the hardest class to PTFO with. I couldn't care less about hillhumpers. If we had bolt action rifles that were strong in close or medium range relative to the other classes, I wouldn't even complain if their long ranged performance sucked. As it is now in BFV, the G43 is better for all but the longest of ranges. Which only forces the sniper class more into the hillhumper role for the average player.
Which is why I hate the lack of direction DICE has towards the scout class. Low ammo means you need to move into CQB areas to resupply. The flare can only be deployed a very short distance in front of you, meaning you also need to be in CQB areas to assist your team with it. The pistol swap time and ADS time are slower, making it harder to do well in those ranges. There's no extremely close ranged 12.5 meter OHK like BF4 had. Scope glint at close and medium ranges turns you into an instant target - it's a lot like shoot at the orange Dorito, except it's the bright white flashlight shining at you instead. On the other side of the range spectrum, your bullets drop off to 55 damage (51 on a limb hit) at a mere 60 meters, and bullet drop is significantly higher than any BF game in the history of the entire series. You no longer have an exclusive accuracy at long range advantage due to no RBD. And unrelated to the scout class specifically, you can currently automatically regenerate way too much health over way too short of a period of time. It wouldn't be too big of a deal that your bullets only do 55 damage beyond 60 meters if the enemy couldn't get behind cover for 3 seconds and already survive a 2nd shot. It's as if the min damage is balanced as though there was zero automatic health regen, but that's not the case.
And if the class is just meant to be a support role, then the points you receive for spotting the enemy with the spotting scope, spotting with the spotting flare, friendly spawns on your spawn beacon, and assisting your teammates with kills needs to be drastically increased. You can heal or revive one friendly player and score more points than you get from teammates killing 3 or 4 enemies that you've spotted for them while also playing a strong PTFO combat class. Even assist counts as kills are only worth 20 points on top of the damage you did. Playing scout (recon) as a support role in BF4 for example was actually rewarding. I could spend the whole match flying around in the MAV relaying enemy positions to my team and actually score well by doing so thus making my impact on the team effort clear.
I can attest with my over 40 service stars on the MP-18 Trench (a supposedly 'terrible' SMG) that running around as an Assault without even aiming down your sights is much easier than most other playstyles ... you do take some risks, such as people sitting in corners with shotguns, or tanks you didn't expect, or getting caught out in the open, but on a lot of maps, aggressively pushing with an SMG can work absurdly well, and a lot of the time, it isn't even that hard to pull off.
Sniping seems easier because a lot of snipers just sit far away from the objectives. This playstyle has less stress, and allows one to take their time to get a kill, but I can guarantee that a guy pushing with an SMG will get more kills, at a faster rate, and with greater ease. This also works with fast-firing/high DPS LMGs.
For crying out loud, my 'tryhard mode' is either an MP-18 Trench or Support loadout that switches between the Chauchat, BAR, Burton, LMG 08/18 and the Madsen.
My "tryhard mode" is just the typical SMG 08/18 or more recently the Burton LMR in BF1. If I need more range I'll use the LMG 08/18. They're so easy to do well with. Otherwise, when I want a more fun and involved gameplay, I use the Vetterli Carbine, Arisaka Patrol, Martini-Henry Infantry, or SMLE Carbine. I flip between those 4 often.
What skill does it take to shoot an Assault troop from 100+m away as a Sniper when they can't even fire back at you? None.
Try constantly landing 100+m shots and we will talk.
lol. It's like shooting fish in a barrel. Don't act like you can't land 100m shot after 100m shot in BF1.
YOu just were talking about BF1.
In BFV it would be sniping anyone with an smg.
Not everyone can do that. Most of those "god damn snipers" can't.
I think they can. I get killed all the time by low level snipers. IT's not hard to point the mouse and press a button.
Case in point. I was going to play Scout; good thing I didn't. Ended the match 48-8 and never once got killed by a Scout on an apparent open map were scouts just "rack up kills"
Obviously some because since beta you can do the Serpentine bunny hop move and avoid being shot by a Scout who is 100m. Even just changing direct of your run in a casual manner can also do the same thing.
How is clicking a mouse with the Scout class any different to clicking the mouse as any other class?
Assault can't shoot back at distance. That's how it is different. You're also sitting safely behind your team.