This is straight up insulting.

Comments

  • Cpt_Blitz_26
    294 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited February 2019
    I highly doubt they are trying to INSULT us.

    I think they are understaffed, under budgeted, and really when it comes down too it, aren't the best fit for this franchise as a studio...

    But we, and they, have been dealt the cards... so where do we go from here?

    I say we push for more content - good content: factions, maps, weapons, and skins to try and right this ship and keep her from sinking further.

    Can anybody else get behind that?
  • baroncrovax
    254 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Stahlmach wrote: »
    Again: we arent talking here about a Vehicle which you can actually " use " in the Game and which needs to be balanced against others ( another topic where lazy New Dice horribly fails )
    But more or less a Skin for a Plane which highly effects the immersion.
    Highly affects the immersion? In a game where British troops parachute into Norway in 1940 (before the 1st Airborne Division even existed), where German players are using British weapons and vice versa, where everyone has weapons never used by the army they're supposed to be part of, where vehicles that didn't appear until late in the war are running around in 1940, where the uniforms are a silly mishmash of bits and pieces, where players can teleport across the map using a spawn beacon or can be instantly healed of fatal wounds by an injection--but with all that laughably fictional cartoon nonsense going on, it's the lack of a JU-52 that ruins immersion?

    Meanwhile teams can be wildly out of balance, hack users can get away with it for long periods, the network performance is still weak, the UI is a clunky mess, assignments often don't work properly and so on and so forth, and EA has DICE on a tight budget, but why not expend resources creating a transport aircraft players will ride in for a few seconds just for the sake of immersion? Good plan.

    I'm still trying to work out what the actual 'insult' is.

    As stated earlier, we are where we are and continually complaing about the past doesn't help.

    The 'community' have complained about, amongst other things:

    Lack of honesty.
    Lack of transparency.
    Lack of communication.
    Lack of 'histirucal accuracy'.
    Lack of content.

    So now we have a DICE Dev being open and honest about the resource in the studio and engaging with the community about the way ahead.

    Players have complained about Airborne cut scene and lack of JU52.

    So he asks,given the restraints we are under, would you prefer the JU52 at the expense of a future vehicle or would you prefer content?

    Rather than engage constructively on the subject with reasoned opinion about which would be better.....


    Grab the pitch forks and storm the castle.......

    Oh well, let the bandwagon roll on.

    Community: *votes for JU52 over more user vehicles*

    Dice gives them JU52

    One month later

    Community: "where's all the new tanks and planes? Dice are killing this game"


    Seriously, who cares what plane we jump out of?! As one user said earlier, it could have been just a door and I would have been fine. I just need a jumping point.

    What a surprise... someone is already blaming the community for DICE's mismanagement.

    I'm not blaming the community for Dice's mismanagement, I'm blaming the community in it's own mismanagement. And for it's own ability to never be pleased

    Dice has a finite amount of resources and they gave the community a choice of either more content or an aesthetic that will be used for a small fraction of the time. And the community chose an aesthetic.

    You know that if they do create the JU52 instead of more player accessible vehicles that the community will be crying for more content down the line. So the community is mismanaging the decisions placed in front of them, and they're not pleased with their own decisions.

    The community did nothing wrong to be put in this position. Just because an aesthetic won doesn't mean they can't also push for more content, especially a month later.
  • Trokey66
    8799 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    I highly doubt they are trying to INSULT us.

    I think they are understaffed, under budgeted, and really when it comes down too it, aren't the best fit for this franchise as a studio...

    But we, and they, have been dealt the cards... so where do we go from here?

    I say we push for more content - good content: factions, maps, weapons, and skins to try and right this ship and keep her from sinking further.

    Can anybody else get behind that?

    The question is - If they don't have enough resources to model a damn plane, how will they develop actual content like new maps, factions etc?

    They haven't got the resource to 'model a damn plane' BECAUSE They are developing new maps, factions, playable vehicles etc perhaps?
  • DarkestHour138
    995 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    Stahlmach wrote: »
    Again: we arent talking here about a Vehicle which you can actually " use " in the Game and which needs to be balanced against others ( another topic where lazy New Dice horribly fails )
    But more or less a Skin for a Plane which highly effects the immersion.
    Highly affects the immersion? In a game where British troops parachute into Norway in 1940 (before the 1st Airborne Division even existed), where German players are using British weapons and vice versa, where everyone has weapons never used by the army they're supposed to be part of, where vehicles that didn't appear until late in the war are running around in 1940, where the uniforms are a silly mishmash of bits and pieces, where players can teleport across the map using a spawn beacon or can be instantly healed of fatal wounds by an injection--but with all that laughably fictional cartoon nonsense going on, it's the lack of a JU-52 that ruins immersion?

    Meanwhile teams can be wildly out of balance, hack users can get away with it for long periods, the network performance is still weak, the UI is a clunky mess, assignments often don't work properly and so on and so forth, and EA has DICE on a tight budget, but why not expend resources creating a transport aircraft players will ride in for a few seconds just for the sake of immersion? Good plan.

    I'm still trying to work out what the actual 'insult' is.

    As stated earlier, we are where we are and continually complaing about the past doesn't help.

    The 'community' have complained about, amongst other things:

    Lack of honesty.
    Lack of transparency.
    Lack of communication.
    Lack of 'histirucal accuracy'.
    Lack of content.

    So now we have a DICE Dev being open and honest about the resource in the studio and engaging with the community about the way ahead.

    Players have complained about Airborne cut scene and lack of JU52.

    So he asks,given the restraints we are under, would you prefer the JU52 at the expense of a future vehicle or would you prefer content?

    Rather than engage constructively on the subject with reasoned opinion about which would be better.....


    Grab the pitch forks and storm the castle.......

    Oh well, let the bandwagon roll on.

    Community: *votes for JU52 over more user vehicles*

    Dice gives them JU52

    One month later

    Community: "where's all the new tanks and planes? Dice are killing this game"


    Seriously, who cares what plane we jump out of?! As one user said earlier, it could have been just a door and I would have been fine. I just need a jumping point.

    What a surprise... someone is already blaming the community for DICE's mismanagement.

    I'm not blaming the community for Dice's mismanagement, I'm blaming the community in it's own mismanagement. And for it's own ability to never be pleased

    Dice has a finite amount of resources and they gave the community a choice of either more content or an aesthetic that will be used for a small fraction of the time. And the community chose an aesthetic.

    You know that if they do create the JU52 instead of more player accessible vehicles that the community will be crying for more content down the line. So the community is mismanaging the decisions placed in front of them, and they're not pleased with their own decisions.

    The community did nothing wrong to be put in this position. Just because an aesthetic won doesn't mean they can't also push for more content, especially a month later.

    I didn't say they did anything wrong to be put in this position. But the fact is they are on this position. And they can (and will) push for more content in the future. But the option was placed in front of them now and they chose a skin over player usable content.
  • LankRich
    115 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    "The C47 was as expensive to make as any vehicle plus it has a high detailed interior and crew."

    **** off fella. The amount of money you made ripping people off for the Deluxe version should have been enough to cover expenses for things like that. Plus the whole parachuting experience really wasn't that impressive..

    If they're that tight, they should offer work experience for University Students to go and graft for the week.
    I studied Animation Production at uni for 3 years and plenty of companies offered opportunities for Animation students to work (unpaid) for a week. Students would jump at the opportunity. Plus it would have cost them pennies in the grand scheme of things, had they got this game right on release and the sales were up.
  • Astr0damus
    2904 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    When I watched this clip about Zappos "work culture", I immediately thought, I bet this is how they get down at DICE-- probably riding skateboards down hallways etc.. I apologize in advance if my assumption is incorrect.
    ===
  • fakemon64
    898 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    The real question is: how much does it cost to create a vehicle in battlefield.

    For the life of me i can't seem to believe something like the tiger took upwards of hundreds of thousands of dollars or countless hours of research and development to make.

    Im not trying to downplay the work it takes to program or anything but i just dont see how a single vehicle could necessarily be 'expensive' in relation to everything that goes into a modern game.

    Personally, i would think things like cinematics and voice overs to be more expensive things that would longer to develop and record.
  • mf_shro0m
    2291 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    diagoro wrote: »
    y_j_es_i wrote: »
    diagoro wrote: »
    This just clarifies my fears for V, if not the franchise. BF is zero priority for EA, and is being squeezed thin for other games. Devs should never have to make these decisions.

    Think it's time for another s$$# storm EA's way. I really can't hold Dice all that responsible now, not if much of their team is being siphoned off to other games, while the budget is getting increasingly tightened.

    Screw EA at this point....

    I don’t think it’s that, I think EA’s just lost touch with their customers and have gotten even greedier. EA’s yearly revenue’s huge. They could easily have expanded the team at Dice and made BFV a blinding success. Had they done that, they actually could’ve/would’ve taken a sizable bite out of CoD fan base. What would that mean? Increased long-term sales, revenue and profit$$$.

    What did they do instead? Cut funding and rush the release, ultimately putting out a game that’s about a year away from completion. They bricked it

    The only somewhat positive I can think of on EA’s part is the fact that the decision to remove premium content was Dice’s I remember hearing.

    And yet, removing premium will also bite the game in the rear......Live service guarantees no content, no readmap, minimal content. At least with Premium there was a 'contract' for extra content'.

    Funny innit?
    They did it because they didn’t want to divide the player base.
    I mean I gotta commend Dice on their altruism at times but the fact is that they really needed to have a bigger budget to make BFV the success it should’ve been, especially if they were to make it happen by EA’s deadline
  • drbobcat
    17 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    EA FY 2018 revenue was what? $7.7 Billion USD? And they can't give you guys enough resources to do both? Why are we paying AAA prices for these titles? I agree with the OP. This is a bit insulting. However, I don't necessarily blame Niklas.

    Buys a new car... "Do you want the brakes on all the wheels to work? Or do you want the car to shift in to 5th gear?" Pick one, sir.

    THAT is what is bothering me here. I was not defending EA in my earlier post. I was defending Niklas. Do any of you genuinely think he is the one to blame for the game is in? Was he the guy that said the game had to come out in November and not six months later? Was he the guy that said we had to have a single player element in the game at all? Was he the guy who decided the contents of the Deluxe Edition and how they'd be delivered?
    No, he wasn't.
    It was the shitheels in EA that penny pinch at every conceivable juncture . It was EA that cared more about pleasing their investors over delivering an entertaining product. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ on them. Spit on their faces (not literally. I'm not calling for harassment, obviously). Don't go after the guy who's struggling enough as is, desperately trying to make the best of a terrible situation. He's getting flak from his bosses for not making them enough money (despite the fact that they made record profits last year). He's also getting flak from all of you demanding he pull a miracle out of his ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
    Again, you deserve a better game. It's practically criminal that they tried to pulled over what they did. But the blame falls on those who control the budget and decide how it's used. The blame falls on EA.
  • Astr0damus
    2904 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    They are stretched too thin... I remember when there was just Conquest and CTF (Capture the Flag) then they wanted to have EVERY mode for EVERY player.
    BF3 was so awesome, all they had to do was come out with 16 new maps each year and call it BF3.1, BF3.2, BF3.3, etc.. all the way to 2025.. it would never get old. How can choppers and smart-weapons get old? No reason to change TIME PERIODS to try to re-write history the way the Politically Correct crowd wants WW II to have been, no need for horses for crying out loud. What's next, lighting the fuse on dynamite with wet matches?
    Please join us back to the future.
    ===========================
    DeLorean-DMC-12.jpg
  • parkingbrake
    3202 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    With expectation this low, next BF game might just be a roblox with better shaders. You people are forgetting the fact that BF is a AAA game with huge production budget. We have all rights to expect a full experience from it.
    Not as huge as it used to be, that's clear from all the recycled BF1 content, the slow pace of new content, the slow rate at which patches are appearing. And that makes sense because BFV doesn't have the source of ongoing revenue previous titles had--paid DLC and Premium--so EA isn't going to allow DICE to burn money like it did on the older titles. If they never get skin sales off the ground in a big way I can't see EA pouring money into this game just for laughs.

    BF4 had 33 maps before it was done, BFV will be lucky to have half that many.

  • diagoro
    1591 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    y_j_es_i wrote: »
    diagoro wrote: »
    y_j_es_i wrote: »
    diagoro wrote: »
    This just clarifies my fears for V, if not the franchise. BF is zero priority for EA, and is being squeezed thin for other games. Devs should never have to make these decisions.

    Think it's time for another s$$# storm EA's way. I really can't hold Dice all that responsible now, not if much of their team is being siphoned off to other games, while the budget is getting increasingly tightened.

    Screw EA at this point....

    I don’t think it’s that, I think EA’s just lost touch with their customers and have gotten even greedier. EA’s yearly revenue’s huge. They could easily have expanded the team at Dice and made BFV a blinding success. Had they done that, they actually could’ve/would’ve taken a sizable bite out of CoD fan base. What would that mean? Increased long-term sales, revenue and profit$$$.

    What did they do instead? Cut funding and rush the release, ultimately putting out a game that’s about a year away from completion. They bricked it

    The only somewhat positive I can think of on EA’s part is the fact that the decision to remove premium content was Dice’s I remember hearing.

    And yet, removing premium will also bite the game in the rear......Live service guarantees no content, no readmap, minimal content. At least with Premium there was a 'contract' for extra content'.

    Funny innit?
    They did it because they didn’t want to divide the player base.
    I mean I gotta commend Dice on their altruism at times but the fact is that they really needed to have a bigger budget to make BFV the success it should’ve been, especially if they were to make it happen by EA’s deadline

    I think it had less to do with dividing the community, than live service allowing EA to control costs. They can cut the cord whenever they want, and stick to the two year model.
  • Kashik1985
    76 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member

    BF4 had 33 maps before it was done, BFV will be lucky to have half that many.

    How many maps are we at now? 9?

    I bet we get 3 more, max, before EA pull the plug on this one.

    A real shame. A couple weeks after launch I really thought this game could turn into the best BF yet.

  • TEKNOCODE
    11557 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Astr0damus wrote: »
    When I watched this clip about Zappos "work culture", I immediately thought, I bet this is how they get down at DICE-- probably riding skateboards down hallways etc.. I apologize in advance if my assumption is incorrect.
    ===
    Zappos customer service is absolutely amazing. 🤷🏻‍♀️
  • Astr0damus
    2904 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    TEKNOCODE wrote: »
    Astr0damus wrote: »
    When I watched this clip about Zappos "work culture", I immediately thought, I bet this is how they get down at DICE-- probably riding skateboards down hallways etc.. I apologize in advance if my assumption is incorrect.
    ===
    Zappos customer service is absolutely amazing. 🤷🏻‍♀️

    Are you wearing a tu-tu?
    (oh wait, it's Monday--I'll ask you tomorrow)
  • Fliple
    30 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    If you look at all the studios that have released games for EA recently only 1 seems to have put effort into making sure they send out a finished game. Dice & Bioware are two studios that should know better yet seem to not care any more for the people who pay them. Yes OP I agree it's rather insulting.

    Also the only one that didn't use Frostbite... coincidence?
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