Was live service doomed from the start?

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MAJWolfcookies
556 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
Or did it die due to poor execution in EA/DICE's hands? Probably the latter given their track record.

Comments

  • SirSpectacle
    756 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    The main problem with the live service is kids like the OP with an unrealistic idea of how much content they can expect for free.
  • GRAW2ROBZ
    1286 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Poor execution because Bad Company 3 already had 2+ years in development.  But top dogs wanted that game for next generation launch title.  So this game was forced out to early and wasn't ready.
  • MAJWolfcookies
    556 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited June 12
    The main problem with the live service is kids like the OP with an unrealistic idea of how much content they can expect for free.

    Wrong. The problem with live service is that 1) needs a healthy player base and 2) it relies on ppl like you who uses daddy's credit card to load up on MTX to decorate your customized tiara. L🤣😆🤣😆🤣😆🤣L! Beat it!
  • MAJWolfcookies
    556 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    The main problem with the live service is kids like the OP with an unrealistic idea of how much content they can expect for free.

    Btw- the game isn't free. Wrong forum. Fortnite forum is down the hall.
  • dA_9_eL_81
    1822 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member

    the issues with BFV is like a track-record of everything that could go wrong went (terribly) wrong:

    1) Revealtrailer - caused a huge uprise due to a certain robotic-armed woman - I guess this killed off 30% of the playerbase

    2) Release got pushed back a month - therefore players expected a finished polised game at release. 

    3) The game got discounted 3 weeks after release for up to 50% off... Again: a large portion of players got mad cause they either dished out 80 EUR for the deluxe (which had no real content except the 5 days early access)

    4) Implementation of Firestorm... Can anyone tell me WTF is playing this gamemode on a regular basis?

    5) actually I could ramble on for hours... But as all this critique is obviously isnt reaching DICE there is no point in continuing...




  • MatthewSkeet
    382 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited June 12
    GRAW2ROBZ said:
    Poor execution because Bad Company 3 already had 2+ years in development.  But top dogs wanted that game for next generation launch title.  So this game was forced out to early and wasn't ready.
    source (specially for that first part) otherwise it's  a complete codswallop 
  • Astr0damus
    2901 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
      ...a complete codswallop 
    Call
    of
    Duty
    sales
    will
    always
    loom
    largely
    over
    publication dates for Battlefield titles.
  • Noodlesocks
    2658 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    With this game, yes. They had to take the folks working on the content away from what they were working on to help get the game ready for launch which was a month late and still not feature complete. Development on the game has been very far behind from before launch.
  • Zviko0
    1533 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Could be both. God knows what they had planned for this or maybe it's the next game that is going to be delayed a bit which means they can take time with it.

    Idea was great with ToW but it's too slow. 7 months after release and we are still in early 1941 with only 2 (or 3?) new maps. We should be in around 1943 with 11-12 new maps. 23-25 overall after 15-18 months after release. That would be ideal. But at this rate we will reach the end of the war in late 2021 with 12  maps overall. 

    If the latter is/was their plan then I'm hoping for premium pass for the future Battlefield games.
  • SirTerrible
    1639 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    By the end of this year the total number of DLC maps will actually be ok. I don't think the volume of content is at all the biggest problem with the game. Like, not even close. For me anyway.
  • ninjapenquinuk
    1769 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Part of the problem is people's expectations. Also DICE are obvioulsy So far behind in development. If at the beginning of the year the road map said a new map every 2-2.5 months I think most people would be OK with that, but they are so far behind that promising a few maps at the end of the year just doesn't look or feel good.
  • Noodlesocks
    2658 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited June 12
    Can you show me a single game with a live service that brought more content than BF Premium model? Live service was doomed from the start because there is no way in hell that free content model will bring more content than a paid model.

    Team Fortress 2
    Counterstrike Global Offensive
    Rainbow Six Siege
    Overwatch
    Grand Theft Auto 5
    Fortnite
     
    It's not live service that is the problem. It's Dice Sweden and EAs failure to implement it properly.
  • YourLocalPlumber
    2717 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Can you show me a single game with a live service that brought more content than BF Premium model? Live service was doomed from the start because there is no way in hell that free content model will bring more content than a paid model.

    Team Fortress 2
    Counterstrike Global Offensive
    Rainbow Six Siege
    Overwatch
    Grand Theft Auto 5
    Fortnite
     
    It's not live service that is the problem. It's Dice Sweden and EAs failure to implement it properly.
    TF2 is F2P
    CSGO is the game where people play a single map for 10k hours and don't even notice.
    R6 Siege has alot of content? A single map and operator every now and then, also its somewhat P2W.
    Overwatch isn't getting much content either.
    GTA is open world game, what does it have to do with FPS games?
    Fortnite LOL. another F2P game.
  • bran1986
    5601 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    I think the live service model was used to cover up how far behind they were/are. The game was pumped out after a year and a half of development and they knew the content was going to be late in coming. Selling premium and needing to tell potential customers what is in it and when you could expect it would have been suicide. Imagine telling customers buying premium that it would be UK and Germany for a year in a supposed WW2 game.

    I think they realized this and went with the live service system to give them time to actually finish the game. This way they placate all the screaming YouTubers calling for free content, buy some goodwil with people who didn't pay for premium, and it gave them some time to add content they intended to be in the game when it was supposed to release.

    Tldr: I don't think it is incompetence by dice, live service was used to finish the game.
  • ragnarok013
    2925 postsMember, Moderator, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Moderator
    Can you show me a single game with a live service that brought more content than BF Premium model? Live service was doomed from the start because there is no way in hell that free content model will bring more content than a paid model.

    Team Fortress 2
    Counterstrike Global Offensive
    Rainbow Six Siege
    Overwatch
    Grand Theft Auto 5
    Fortnite
     
    It's not live service that is the problem. It's Dice Sweden and EAs failure to implement it properly.
    Noodlesocks I'm an avid Overwatch player and OW is one of the best executed live services I've ever see but content still dribbles out in OW with many events just being rehashed from the previous year. The only real new content is new skins (which isn't really comparable to new maps and weapons in former BF expansions) and then the archives\uprising annual event that adds more lore with other seasonal events being largely unchanged.

  • parkingbrake
    3202 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    The problem with Live Service in a game from EA is that EA thinks it means that free added content has to be matched by low development costs.  When BF had paid DLC/Premium EA was committed to expansion packs with four maps each (plus new weapons, vehicles etc.) several times a year, but the price we paid for either Premium or individual DLC covered those development costs.  For example, the initial wave of Premium sales in BF4 brought in sixty million dollars, that's a lot of map design time.  So BF4 went from ten maps at release to thirty-three maps at the end of development, plus a year of heavy repair work to fix a game horribly unfinished at launch.

    With BFV, EA didn't know how lucrative skin sales would be (and they had been burned by the backlash over microtransactions in SWBF2) so they have kept DICE on a relatively tight budget, thus the recycled BF1 weapons, the use of one tank chassis for multiple (sometimes fictional) vehicles and only two new maps in half a year.  The lack of content is directly tied to an expectation of lower revenues due to this game's business model--less revenue = less new content.  EA has made the decision to offer a smaller, cheaper BF game.  It's all about cutting costs, just like a business that moves its factory to China and its customer phone support to India, lower costs means higher profits.

    If BFV had launched with a guaranteed twenty additional maps over the next year or eighteen months, I'd have happily paid a hundred bucks for it.  Added content isn't free, I get that, I don't expect a game publisher to add twenty maps at no cost.  So either they have paid DLC, or an alternate source of revenue like skin sales, or the base price of the game has to go up.  EA chose the least attractive of those options, they kept the price the same and hoped we'd be okay with a trickle of new content, while also hoping we'd go nuts buying cosmetics (which was always a foolish idea).

    If BF6 repeats these errors--Live Service, no rented servers (so far), poor network performance, weak anti-cheat on PC, out-of-region lag--then it would have to be the best-designed, most polished, absolutely amazing game ever for me to even think about buying it.  EA has simply made the BF franchise a less attractive product. 
  • TFBisquit
    1349 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Dear people, there was insufficient capacity for a premium service. They simply could not deliver the maps and items associated with that.
    That's why they opted for a live service, to relieve some of the strain involved when working on those dlc maps.
    Premium service or a certain amount of map packs was never an option. Never.
    Because if they could, they would go that route asap, simply because of a bigger revenue.
  • YourLocalPlumber
    2717 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    TFBisquit said:
    Dear people, there was insufficient capacity for a premium service. They simply could not deliver the maps and items associated with that.
    That's why they opted for a live service, to relieve some of the strain involved when working on those dlc maps.
    Premium service or a certain amount of map packs was never an option. Never.
    Because if they could, they would go that route asap, simply because of a bigger revenue.
    I call BS on that. BF4 was also developed in about 2 years, same as BF5. Yet for some reason BF4 had a ton of content at launch, along with Premium content being announced even before the game was released.  BF4 was a full game with nothing cut out of it. Yes it was extremely unpolished because of rushed development. But BF5 is unpolished, its STILL missing core features. And to put a cherry on top, we're over 7 months into BF5s release, and it still has less content than BF4 AT LAUNCH 

      The only reason why EA_Dice decided to go with Live Service model is because it requires little to no effort to develop. Few recycled guns and skin each month with occasional map here and there is nothing special to develop.

    Also they've made a huge mistake by trying to get a piece of that sweet BR pie with Firestorm.
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