Bombers, Bombers Everywhere Now. What's the solution?

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cashm0n3y08
159 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
Since the buff to the AA and FF I'm seeing far less fighters in the air now then ever before. Last night I played Mercury, Twisted Steel, and Arras, and I saw and shot down 1 fighter, a spitfire on Twisted Steel. Now that AA can just wreck fighters, no one even wants to use them, so now the bombers are even more prevalent despite the intention of the AA buff which was to address the cries of infantry players getting carpet bombed. 

On the subject of bombers, I don't think the solution of deleting them entirely would be right, but rather remove them from the spawn screen and instead treat them like the Sturmtiger where you need to use squad points to buy it, perhaps 30,000 points. 

And with fighters? Which happen to be the best counter to bombers, the AA, especially FF, is just too effective for the average joe getting into a 109. Last night on Arras for example, I was in a 109 G2 and the entire game the Brits had an MAA and an active SAA in their spawn where infantry couldn't get to them. There was no way for me to even begin to counter that so I just ignored them and avoided flying past E flag, taking damage everytime I flew past B flag as the AA reaches all the way past the German spawn area. I went 28-2 (both deaths from FF when I was trailing a bomber) and shot down bomber after bomber, taking massive AA flak each time as they would try to escape back into their friendly AA cover after dumping their payloads. Never seen so many bombers

If I wasn't in that lobby, those British bombers would have wrecked our team with that AA help they had. A new to average pilot who tries to get into a fighter now are just going to get wrecked by AA, especially on Arras where the AA covers most of the map. Good fighter pilots will still eat, they just have to repair constantly, I just feel bad for people who are just now trying to learn how to fly fighters, I'm sure after a couple tries they will give up and try the bombers.

Get used to more bombers now.

Comments

  • NLBartmaN
    4484 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    So heavy bombers finally can stay in the air longer than 1 minute and not be shot down at spawning in by a camping easymode OP fighter?

    Now please buff their damage potential so they can actually hit something on the ground when flying (and not be able to see anything on the ground) at the ceiling of a map.
    Diving lower to hit something is a certain death.

    9 out of 10 heavy bombers will still be insane easy to shoot down, 2 shots with a FF (you have more than enough time to make 2 shots on that slow moving insane big plane), but even with a Tank.
  • G-Gnu
    1526 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Bombers , why the H are they even in the game. They should have learned that lesson from BF1.
    Answer: DICE -2.0 where all the leftovers are still working.
  • NLBartmaN
    4484 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    G-Gnu said:
    Bombers , why the H are they even in the game. They should have learned that lesson from BF1.
    Answer: DICE -2.0 where all the leftovers are still working.
    Yeah, why put vehicles, that are insane easy to destroy, in a Battlefield game ...
  • fragnstein
    750 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited May 22
    AA actually works now so people use it. Planes are still good, pilots just need to adapt and wait for their ground troops to draw attention of the enemy and help take out the AA .

    As far as more bombers, it probably pilots trying to do something to get some quick easy kills. Fortunately the MAA is still effective as well as the FF against bombers
  • cashm0n3y08
    159 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    fragnstein wrote: »
    AA actually works now so people use it. Planes are still good, pilots just need to adapt and wait for their ground troops to draw attention of the enemy and help take out the AA .

    As far as more bombers, it probably pilots trying to do something to get some quick easy kills. Fortunately the MAA is still effective as well as the FF against bombers

    The problem is on maps like Arras and Twisted Steel and even Panzerstorm where the AA is placed in the spawn where opposing infantry can't reach. Also MAA is able to sit in the spawn away from assault troops. The MAA can also sit right next to its resupply thus never running out of ammo or repairs.

    There is only one counter to this if you're in a fighter, and it's an extremely difficult one. You have to destroy the resupply with missiles first, then after you resupply you missile the MAA until he needs to go to the spawn resupply that you just destroyed. Sometimes this takes multiple attempts, as you have to hit him a few times to burn his quick repair and get him down to low health. It's best to wait until he's shooting at another plane. Once he heads back to the resupply he has to get out of the MAA to repair the resupply, and that's when you strike, when he's out of the tank hammering away like he's Johnny Hammersticks. You have about 5 second window to pull this off, but it is possible, have done it quite a few times, have also failed quite a few times. It's easier if you have another fighter pilot working with you on mic.

    The spawn resupply is not a good idea. There should be more of them in the playable area instead of in the spawn.
  • CT1924
    1141 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    How about we split fighter and bomber spawn? That way, we can have a set number of each.
  • GenCuster
    160 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    You said it yourself...
    You still finished 28-2 using an M109 G2....
    Good pilots will still fly...
    Those who made farming score easily now will have more 'difficulty'...
    who wants to start flying.... world of warplane.... free game

  • SirBobdk
    5090 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    GenCuster wrote: »
    You said it yourself...

    who wants to start flying.... world of warplane.... free game

    Who dont like planes... cod
  • spychodelics
    341 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    SirBobdk said:
    GenCuster wrote: »
    You said it yourself...

    who wants to start flying.... world of warplane.... free game

    Who dont like planes... cod
    It is easier than that, you can just choose to play maps and mods without airplanes. No need to go to another game. I dont know why infantry wants to play so bad Large Conquest on Fjell with up to 6 planes per team. Demanding buff after buff. 
  • SirBobdk
    5090 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    (Quote)
    It is easier than that, you can just choose to play maps and mods without airplanes. No need to go to another game. I dont know why infantry wants to play so bad Large Conquest on Fjell with up to 6 planes per team. Demanding buff after buff. 

    Exactly. This game have more maps than ever without planes and even maps with planes where you hardly notice them. 21 Maps and people complain because there is 3-4 maps where planes dominate. Planes are nothing like in past BF games. People have a short memory or didnt play those games.
  • almothana11
    35 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    idk... people were already choosing bombers over fighters because Dice allows you to choose whatever plane you want.
    and I don't see how this update makes bombers more appealing than fighters, it's not like the 5.0 update where the FF was first introduced and high altitude bombing was the meta. right now AA can still reach you even if you were at max height so it doesn't really matter if you're in a bomber or a fighter.
    I actually think that fighters are now better than bombers because fighters have rockets. I personally used to play in the Blenheim but now I use the VB instead. you can snipe SAA from miles away.
  • tempo_rarity
    1281 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    edited May 23
    Your described round actually sounds pretty normal to me , mathematically anyway .
    It had good Bombers , good AA-ers , and one good Fighter pilot in it .
    Play with these numbers a bit - make the Bombers slightly less good , the AA's slightly less sure-shotted , or even add another Fighter to your side , an-n-d . . . 
    That round will look pretty normal too .

    "(Five) is like a box of chocolates ; you never know what you're gonna get"
     ;) 

    On a deep flank to steal Hamada's 'A' , this Recon spots their MAA using the Resupply station there .
    A few bullets into the depots large fuel tank - BOOM - Mr MAA must now go find another one or . . .
    Risk stepping out of their ride for a repair job on it .
    They wisely chose the first option but then the forced drive out into the open got them killed .
    In a sense , my Lee-Enfield killed an MAA  :p 
  • TFBisquit
    2221 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    SirBobdk said:
    (Quote)
    It is easier than that, you can just choose to play maps and mods without airplanes. No need to go to another game. I dont know why infantry wants to play so bad Large Conquest on Fjell with up to 6 planes per team. Demanding buff after buff. 

    Exactly. This game have more maps than ever without planes and even maps with planes where you hardly notice them. 21 Maps and people complain because there is 3-4 maps where planes dominate. Planes are nothing like in past BF games. People have a short memory or didnt play those games.

    Well, I don't see many people complaining about air superiority, since patch 6.2. Just a handfull on this forum. and fjell was already ignored by many players.
    So to me, this buff or nerf depending how you look at it, came as a surprise.
    I do feel these changes are all because of the pacific theatre, which suffered the most from being bombed by anything that flies.
    -
    As for having bombers in the game,
    NLBartmaN said:
    G-Gnu said:
    Bombers , why the H are they even in the game. They should have learned that lesson from BF1.
    Answer: DICE -2.0 where all the leftovers are still working.
    Yeah, why put vehicles, that are insane easy to destroy, in a Battlefield game ...

    They are quite different from vehicles and are misplaced in any kind of first person shooter, now and in the past. More suited for single player campaigns, where even there it will feel like a forced qte.
    Making vehicles vulnerable is to prevent that they dominate the rounds. Which was a problem in BF3 for instance. Even the urban maps suffered from the lav, where some could go on insane kill streaks.
    On the positive side, one could avoid tanks and planes in BF3 since most maps are big enough and have plenty to do for those vehicles.
    -
    As for the comparison with cod, in general, that always amazes me, so many shooters that look and play the same. They are all more or less based on the same disciplines, with minor differences.
    In any case, call of duty has always done better financially, and still has a larger player base than BF. The fact they now also want more players in a server is simply adapting to general demand. Just as Battlefield is doing too.

  • SirBobdk
    5090 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    @TFBisquit
    Agree. The problem was isolated to fjell and the pacific maps and especialy BT and iwo/storm. The pacific planes have been nerfed so much the last patches that there was no need for a buff of AA/FF. The SAA on pacific maps was allready quit strong.
    imo pacific was better before the nerf of FF. It could have been solved with a small nerf of 20mm and bomb circle and a small buff of the MAA. Now Its just broken imo.
  • olavafar
    2241 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    If I remember it correctly, this is exactly what I predicted when the first happy thread about the AA buff came.
  • The_BERG_366
    2666 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    NLBartmaN said:
    So heavy bombers finally can stay in the air longer than 1 minute and not be shot down at spawning in by a camping easymode OP fighter?

    Now please buff their damage potential so they can actually hit something on the ground when flying (and not be able to see anything on the ground) at the ceiling of a map.
    Diving lower to hit something is a certain death.

    9 out of 10 heavy bombers will still be insane easy to shoot down, 2 shots with a FF (you have more than enough time to make 2 shots on that slow moving insane big plane), but even with a Tank.
    oh yeah cause its an amazing idea to have untouchable bombers at the flight ceiling killing everyone on the ground. If anything YOU want bomber to farm kills "easy mode". 
  • NLBartmaN
    4484 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    TFBisquit said:
    They are quite different from vehicles and are misplaced in any kind of first person shooter, now and in the past. More suited for single player campaigns, where even there it will feel like a forced qte.

    So a plane is not a vehicle?
    And why would they be misplaced?

    They are insane weak in BF V and insane easy to destroy.
    In BF V it is far easier to get lots of kills with a fighter (yeah Stuka and Mosquito are NOT heavy bombers) than with a heavy bomber

    I would say: remove very small, easy to move, very fast planes that ALSO have bombs or powerful rockets and were VERY hard to destroy before the last patch (aka noob fighter planes), from the game.
  • spychodelics
    341 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    SirBobdk said:
    @TFBisquit
    Agree. The problem was isolated to fjell and the pacific maps and especialy BT and iwo/storm. The pacific planes have been nerfed so much the last patches that there was no need for a buff of AA/FF. The SAA on pacific maps was allready quit strong.
    imo pacific was better before the nerf of FF. It could have been solved with a small nerf of 20mm and bomb circle and a small buff of the MAA. Now Its just broken imo.

    I only play the pacific playlist and IMHO the AA buff in range not in dmg on Pacific was wrong. Currently the AAs reach to far. Could have been solved by altering the planes and the rocket / bomb accuracy. Make it harder for pilots to master not easier for infantry to counter. 
  • The_BERG_366
    2666 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Since the buff to the AA and FF I'm seeing far less fighters in the air now then ever before. Last night I played Mercury, Twisted Steel, and Arras, and I saw and shot down 1 fighter, a spitfire on Twisted Steel. Now that AA can just wreck fighters, no one even wants to use them, so now the bombers are even more prevalent despite the intention of the AA buff which was to address the cries of infantry players getting carpet bombed. 

    On the subject of bombers, I don't think the solution of deleting them entirely would be right, but rather remove them from the spawn screen and instead treat them like the Sturmtiger where you need to use squad points to buy it, perhaps 30,000 points. 

    And with fighters? Which happen to be the best counter to bombers, the AA, especially FF, is just too effective for the average joe getting into a 109. Last night on Arras for example, I was in a 109 G2 and the entire game the Brits had an MAA and an active SAA in their spawn where infantry couldn't get to them. There was no way for me to even begin to counter that so I just ignored them and avoided flying past E flag, taking damage everytime I flew past B flag as the AA reaches all the way past the German spawn area. I went 28-2 (both deaths from FF when I was trailing a bomber) and shot down bomber after bomber, taking massive AA flak each time as they would try to escape back into their friendly AA cover after dumping their payloads. Never seen so many bombers

    If I wasn't in that lobby, those British bombers would have wrecked our team with that AA help they had. A new to average pilot who tries to get into a fighter now are just going to get wrecked by AA, especially on Arras where the AA covers most of the map. Good fighter pilots will still eat, they just have to repair constantly, I just feel bad for people who are just now trying to learn how to fly fighters, I'm sure after a couple tries they will give up and try the bombers.

    Get used to more bombers now.
    what you described happened is pretty much what should happen in this scenario imo. don't see whats wrong with this. don't see how the bombers are an issue when one single fighter (you) can counter them all. This scenario in fact shows why fighters are still important and how lacking them can render your whole air useless (like it happened for your opposing team). 
  • G-Gnu
    1526 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    NLBartmaN said:
    G-Gnu said:
    Bombers , why the H are they even in the game. They should have learned that lesson from BF1.
    Answer: DICE -2.0 where all the leftovers are still working.
    Yeah, why put vehicles, that are insane easy to destroy, in a Battlefield game ...
    Because they do not know how to do good games anymore, they did remove auto loading but decided to have hovering reload somethings for air instead with instantiations reload. Tank stations you can at least destroy.
    I think tanks are more weak on certain maps (read most) because of bad map layout//topography. Hence the tank camping on a lot of maps, or a lot of camping overall in this game. Pretty effing boring if you ask me and it is no wonder they dropped this game like a stone. 

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