No automatic minimap spotting when firing!!!!

Comments

  • eztarget77
    225 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited June 2016
    Is 3D spotting still around though? If it is, doesn't it kind of defeat the purpose of removing it from the minimap?
  • Loqtrall
    12468 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    edited June 2016
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    I thought it was a good feature. It made the suppressor worth using. Now I think it puts and unfair disadvantage to anyone who uses stock earbuds.

    Well considering there won't be any suppressors in this game (more than likely), the feature being there would be pointless other than, like I said earlier, hand-holding the players through situational awareness.

    Either way, with Battlefield's sound design alone, anybody who's not using stereo headphones or a mean *** audio system are going to be at a disadvantage.

    I understand no silencers are in BF1, but still the disadvantage is for people who are using the stock earbud. Basically they are saying if you buy some good headphones you will have the advantage.

    lol that's like saying someone who plays on a crystal clear insane 4k resolution monitor shouldn't have an advantage over someone that plays on a black and white fuzzy tv.

    Better peripherals is always an inherent advantage.

    No its not actually. What I'm saying is you have to make it fair for the people who use stock. You cant plug the PS4 in any TV, there is a bare minimum that still allows you to see the soldier at average distances.

    The standard earbud won't even let you differentiate footsteps from the left or right, the basics of direction. That's where I say there is a disadvantage, if someone wants to pay for surround sound and high def, fine....just make sure that someone with stock can have a fair shake.

    That's absolutely ridiculous. It's not the fault of other gamers that someone can't afford stereo headphones or a decent PC/TV audio system.

    There are also people who play games with Scuf controllers, allowing them to jump, reload, switch weapons, etc on a controller without taking their thumb off the right thumbstick at all times because there are paddles on the back/bottom of the controller, they also have adjustable hair triggers and thumbsticks.

    Should those people not be able to use their $150 controllers just because some 13 year old that had his mom pick up the game for him can't afford one? I use $200 Turtle Beach and Astro Gaming headsets with literally every game I play, and have been for years - should I stop using them because 95+% of the enemy teams I face aren't going to be using them?

    No. That's dumb logic. Better peripherals have given people advantages since the dawn of online gaming. It's not a cheat, it's not a hack - it's a naturally occurring advantage that literally everyone that plays online games has access to. Just because some people can't afford those things doesn't mean they should be outlawed to "make things fair".

    You 4k vs. Fuzzy black and white TV is invalid since the stock connector won't connect to anything less than component video on PS3 and hdmi on ps4...so yes a 4k would be an advantage but the person on a standard modern TV can still see HD quality so it's not like he can't see at all.

    Again you missed the point. If people want to spend extra money for a so called advantage...fine, that's not the topic. For example, the game was made for a controller...you can aim, shoot, reload, run, and jump with a controller. While a MnK may give you an advantage, there is nothing that a MnK does that you can't do on a stock controller. Now if you are making sounds the key in identifying direction, tell me how you can identify the target coming from the stock earbud. Now all of the sudden it's not "hearing better" its about not hearing at all.

    lmao, first off - I'm assuming you don't know that they make HDMI adapters to connect them to older TVs?

    Secondly - Mouse and Keyboard gives you a HUGE advantage over stock controllers.

    Not only is the average modern laser mouse's DPI substantially higher than that of a controller - but controllers keep moving your aim until the analogue stick reaches dead center, whereas a mouse stops your aim movement literally wherever you stop your mouse. On top of that, you control your aim with an analogue stick on a controller with JUST your thumb - you control your aim with a mouse with your whole hand, wrist, and forearm - it's SIGNIFICANTLY more precise.

    To top it off - playing with a mouse and keyboard allows you to keep on your aim while doing other things like jumping, reloading, melee'ing, switching weapons etc - whereas on a controller - you have to take your fingers off the analogue sticks to press ANY button on the face of the controller (which is why Scuf controllers are so popular, because the paddles on the back allow you to press those face buttons without taking your right thumb off the aiming analogue stick in FPS games).

    Implying a M&KB or Scuf/Elite controller doesn't give you an advantage over someone using a stock controller is just dumb.

    Again, try reading my comments because you still don't get it. We are talking about designing games to the stock system. Yes there are adaptors, but now you're spending money to overcome the fact you can't meet the minimum requirements. If you have to do this, then the disadvantage is on you. Comparing stock HDMI to 4K, will you see a character clearer, possibly, but you won't see something that a person using a 720i resolution can't see.

    As for you MnK, again you need to read. A person using a controller can aim, reload, move the cursor all just like a mouse can. Can a mouse do it better, I believe so, but doing it better is different than not doing it at all. There is not a function that a mouse can do that a controller cant. Changing button configurations can help you do actions while aiming, but when you're reloading you can't shoot anyway so what's the disadvantage of taking you finger off the stick to press the circle button?

    I'll sum it up for you again. Paying to do something better is different than paying to allow you to utilize the core features of the game.

    There's a myriad of things you're missing.

    For one, a mouse can do things that a controller can't - like mapping the fire button and the ADS button on both the keys of the mouse giving you better control of your aim and fire control - it would be like mapping the fire and ADS button to the analogue stick of the controller, which is impossible

    It allows the person to focus an ENTIRE hand on movement and actions, and one ENTIRE hand on aiming and shooting and controlling the weapon.

    That's something you can't do on a controller. In the controller's case, you have ONE THUMB dedicated not only to aiming and melee, but literally almost every other action you must do on a controller.

    Sorry, but there are FOUR face buttons on a controller, and 4 d-pad buttons, you can't map them all to the 2 triggers and 2 bumpers on a controller. A KB&M combo will literally always win, and will always have an advantage over those who use controllers (even modified and Scuf controllers)

    lastly - I said reloading because there are several games where a reload cancel by switching weapons twice is necessary for survival in a lot of situations. I can't tell you how many times a double weapon switch to cancel my reload has saved my life in Black Ops 3 and BF4. If you do that on a normal controller, in most games, you're going to have to take your thumb OFF the right stick, jepordizing your aim, to press "Y" or "Triangle" twice in order to do so. Whereas if I'm using a keyboard or a Scuf controller, I can keep my hand/thumb ON my aim to keep aim at the guy I'm trying to kill, and press Q or Y/Triangle paddle twice in order to do so, and won't have to correct my aim afterwards because it never left the enemy, because my thumb never had to leave the right stick.

    Now - regarding your comment on adapters - that just makes you look like a fool. Because you said that buying an adapter to play on an older TV puts the disadvantage on YOURSELF - but you act like buying and using cheap "stock" (whatever that means) earbuds is not ON YOU. You act like you can't go out and buy a better pair of headphones, or use the stock sound that comes out of whatever you're using (computer speakers, TV speakers, etc).

    Again, using a cheap pair of earbuds, thus giving you a disadvantage in terms of sound awareness in the game, is on YOU. It's not the fault of the developer, or the fault of any other person playing the game with better peripherals. You're the one choosing to use the *** earbuds.
    eztarget77 wrote: »
    Is 3D spotting still around though? If it is, doesn't it kind of defeat the purpose of removing it from the minimap?

    3D spotting is still around, but it doesn't really defeat the purpose of what was removed, because you won't be 3D spotted in the game just for firing your gun. That's the entire point - you shouldn't be penalized for firing a gun in a game literally revolving around the concept of shooting guns, by having your position shown to the enemy on a minimap.

    I wish they'd do the same thing to CoD, because it's unreal how many people rely on you blipping on the minimap after you shoot to acquire your position, run up behind you and kill you.

    There comes a point where the HUD is doing more work to find the enemy than the player is, and that's ridiculous.
  • Rotank
    981 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    This is a good thing. Spotting has gotten a little overboard in the BF series, and needs to complement situational awareness rather than replace it outright.
  • VBALL_MVP
    6177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Again, you are so caught up to calling others dumb that you just bounce around topics. We are talking about making a game compatible with what comes stock with the system. PS4 supplies an earbud with the system, a controller, and a hdmi, suggesting that these are what you need to play games on their systems. You don't need anything else to have full functionality.

    You keep on stating what a MnK can do better, but again a person can do everything that is provided in the like a MnK. I can double tap triangle to cancel a reload and during that animation of a switch I can still get back on aim before my gun is ready to fire...again you are stating what a MnK can do better but still can be done on a stock controller....just a little trickier.

    Only fool here is you, because again go around and purchasing adapros is altering the stock configuration....again PS4 is stating you can have full functionality at HD....if they wanted people to play with less than HD they would offer other connections as stock. I don't understand how you see your black and white TV vs 4k even remotely relevent? When was the last time you were able to play CSGO on a windows 95 computer?

    Show me one PS4 game that you can't see a player if you don't have a 4k tv, or not be able to play the game as intended with a stock controller. Why should this be any different with the stock sound?
  • B3ANTOWN__B3A5T
    4364 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    edited June 2016
    Even if they kept audio spotting the same you'd still be at a sound disadvantage with ear buds because you cant read the direction sounds like footsteps and tank engines are coming from.

    Should we just do away with the massive market that is gaming headsets because you don't have one?

    If sound is so important to you save 100$ and go get a good headset.
  • Loqtrall
    12468 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    Again, you are so caught up to calling others dumb that you just bounce around topics. We are talking about making a game compatible with what comes stock with the system. PS4 supplies an earbud with the system, a controller, and a hdmi, suggesting that these are what you need to play games on their systems. You don't need anything else to have full functionality.

    You keep on stating what a MnK can do better, but again a person can do everything that is provided in the like a MnK. I can double tap triangle to cancel a reload and during that animation of a switch I can still get back on aim before my gun is ready to fire...again you are stating what a MnK can do better but still can be done on a stock controller....just a little trickier.

    Only fool here is you, because again go around and purchasing adapros is altering the stock configuration....again PS4 is stating you can have full functionality at HD....if they wanted people to play with less than HD they would offer other connections as stock. I don't understand how you see your black and white TV vs 4k even remotely relevent? When was the last time you were able to play CSGO on a windows 95 computer?

    Show me one PS4 game that you can't see a player if you don't have a 4k tv, or not be able to play the game as intended with a stock controller. Why should this be any different with the stock sound?

    You do realize that the stock PS4 headset (earbud) is not made for listening to game audio, right? It's made for party chat, just like the Xbox One's stock headset is.

    And you do also realize that Sony sells stock Playstation 4 headsets MADE for listening to in-game audio, right? Literally only made for PS4s. Microsoft does the same thing for Xbone.

    Again - your choice of peripherals is not the fault of game developers, nor anyone else. There are peripherals out there made SPECIFICALLY for your platform, SPECIFICALLY by the people that CREATED your preferred platform.

    Your argument that you can't hear stereo game audio on a MONO headset, so that games should be made so that everyone using a mono headset can hear game audio as greatly as people using stereo headsets do is *** stupid.

    For the last time - do you want to hear the game like other people with stereo headsets? Go buy the stereo headsets that Sony SPECIFICALLY MADE FOR THE PS4.

    There is no disclaimer when you buy a PS4 that everything that comes with it is enough to play ANY game at it's FULL POTENTIAL in terms of peripherals and audio quality.

    And to your "black and white tv vs 4k" tv spiel, I wasn't the one that initially made that argument - you're responding to the wrong person. I just told you (because you felt the need to respond to me about an example I didn't even make) that you CAN play a PS4 on an old SDTV. That's the full extent of what I've said on that subject, so you may want to read in to who you're responding to.

  • VBALL_MVP
    6177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    Loqtrall wrote: »
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    Again, you are so caught up to calling others dumb that you just bounce around topics. We are talking about making a game compatible with what comes stock with the system. PS4 supplies an earbud with the system, a controller, and a hdmi, suggesting that these are what you need to play games on their systems. You don't need anything else to have full functionality.

    You keep on stating what a MnK can do better, but again a person can do everything that is provided in the like a MnK. I can double tap triangle to cancel a reload and during that animation of a switch I can still get back on aim before my gun is ready to fire...again you are stating what a MnK can do better but still can be done on a stock controller....just a little trickier.

    Only fool here is you, because again go around and purchasing adapros is altering the stock configuration....again PS4 is stating you can have full functionality at HD....if they wanted people to play with less than HD they would offer other connections as stock. I don't understand how you see your black and white TV vs 4k even remotely relevent? When was the last time you were able to play CSGO on a windows 95 computer?

    Show me one PS4 game that you can't see a player if you don't have a 4k tv, or not be able to play the game as intended with a stock controller. Why should this be any different with the stock sound?

    You do realize that the stock PS4 headset (earbud) is not made for listening to game audio, right? It's made for party chat, just like the Xbox One's stock headset is.

    And you do also realize that Sony sells stock Playstation 4 headsets MADE for listening to in-game audio, right? Literally only made for PS4s. Microsoft does the same thing for Xbone.

    Again - your choice of peripherals is not the fault of game developers, nor anyone else. There are peripherals out there made SPECIFICALLY for your platform, SPECIFICALLY by the people that CREATED your preferred platform.

    Your argument that you can't hear stereo game audio on a MONO headset, so that games should be made so that everyone using a mono headset can hear game audio as greatly as people using stereo headsets do is *** stupid.

    For the last time - do you want to hear the game like other people with stereo headsets? Go buy the stereo headsets that Sony SPECIFICALLY MADE FOR THE PS4.

    There is no disclaimer when you buy a PS4 that everything that comes with it is enough to play ANY game at it's FULL POTENTIAL in terms of peripherals and audio quality.

    And to your "black and white tv vs 4k" tv spiel, I wasn't the one that initially made that argument - you're responding to the wrong person. I just told you (because you felt the need to respond to me about an example I didn't even make) that you CAN play a PS4 on an old SDTV. That's the full extent of what I've said on that subject, so you may want to read in to who you're responding to.

    Again, list me games where you cannot play, without limitation, with a stock PS4.
  • Loqtrall
    12468 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    Again, list me games where you cannot play, without limitation, with a stock PS4.

    I never implied or said there were any - I said there's no disclaimer or anything else that states that you'll be able to play EVERY game ever made for the PS4 to it's full potential, visually and auditory, with whatever comes stock with the cheapest PS4 that you can purchase.

    That the earbuds provided with cheaper PS4 models are NOT made for listening to stereo sound in video games with good sound design. That Sony MAKES HEADSETS for that purpose, that are ONLY for the PS4.

    There is nothing stating that the earbud that comes stock with cheap PS4s is made for listening to your game. It's specifically a communication headset, just as the stock headset that comes with the Xbone is a communication headset - not a stereo headset made for listening to the game.

    DICE doesn't have to develop their game sound around mono communication headsets just because that's what comes stock with cheap consoles. You can easily go out and buy a stereo headset made SPECIFICALLY for the PS4 BY SONY for $20.
  • B3ANTOWN__B3A5T
    4364 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    How are people still gaming with earbuds in 2016?

    Playing with a nice headset over earbuds is like night and day.
  • eztarget77
    225 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Loqtrall wrote: »

    There comes a point where the HUD is doing more work to find the enemy than the player is, and that's ridiculous.

    That's exactly my point with 3D spotting.
  • Loqtrall
    12468 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    How are people still gaming with earbuds in 2016?

    Playing with a nice headset over earbuds is like night and day.

  • Loqtrall
    12468 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    eztarget77 wrote: »
    Loqtrall wrote: »

    There comes a point where the HUD is doing more work to find the enemy than the player is, and that's ridiculous.

    That's exactly my point with 3D spotting.

    While 3D spotting still does that - removing 2D minimap spotting when someone shoots their gun is a big step forward - as A TON of people use it to locate enemies that they'd otherwise never know were there.

    3D spotting will still hold the hands of a lot of people - but at least you won't be penalized by having your location revealed to everyone around you when you shoot in a video game.

    At least 3D spotting has been improved by canceling out when you lose line of sight on the person you spotted.
  • wildcardx
    106 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    I will miss being able to bait people though. Almost as fun as doing happy birthday with tanks.

    I would actually be ok with some type of heat map spotting on the mini map. Or again some way to ping the mini map for my squad/team.
  • VBALL_MVP
    6177 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    wildcardx wrote: »
    I will miss being able to bait people though. Almost as fun as doing happy birthday with tanks.

    I would actually be ok with some type of heat map spotting on the mini map. Or again some way to ping the mini map for my squad/team.

    The way I see it, it is very practical to have your location shown from the sound of a gun. You telling me that if I shot a gun behind you, that you wouldn't know where it came from?
  • AMEN2THAT
    178 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Even if they kept audio spotting the same you'd still be at a sound disadvantage with ear buds because you cant read the direction sounds like footsteps and tank engines are coming from.
    Lmao

    You guys spamming whole threads with "BF is not realistic game and all", now you want us to ear footsteps and all like we playing in some tactical realistic shooter WHILE we actually playing a fast paced arcade game with run-n-spray and vehicles all around and explosions everywhere (and maybe some players are also in VoIP channels or listening music while playing)

    Removing minimap spotting is a realistic feature but yall super happy about it, when its about more historically accurate details that dont affect any1's style to play yall go emo saying BF is not meant to be a realistic game... the fanboysm is strong around here, objectivty = 0

  • Peccath
    618 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Member
    Wait a second... Is someone really using the stock mono earphone for game audio when playing on consoles?!? That can't be... :confused:
  • Das_reboot1918
    319 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    I would like to applaud DICE for removing automatic minimap spotting of enemies when they fire from BF1!!!

    This was one of the things I REALLY hated in BF3 and BF4. I'm glad it is gone. Now there might actually be some tactics involved in BF instead of just running towards the red triangles on the minimap.

    Brilliant change , now if only 3D spotting would be banished !
  • Lordmang4
    2063 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Medal of Honor Warfighter Member

    This was one of the things I REALLY hated in BF3 and BF4. I'm glad it is gone. Now there might actually be some tactics involved in BF instead of just running towards the red triangles on the minimap.

    Then what would be the point of using silencers?
  • Rev0verDrive
    6762 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    Lordmang4 wrote: »

    This was one of the things I REALLY hated in BF3 and BF4. I'm glad it is gone. Now there might actually be some tactics involved in BF instead of just running towards the red triangles on the minimap.

    Then what would be the point of using silencers?

    Maybe for their actual intended purpose? Not giving away your position via sound.
  • Loqtrall
    12468 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    VBALL_MVP wrote: »
    wildcardx wrote: »
    I will miss being able to bait people though. Almost as fun as doing happy birthday with tanks.

    I would actually be ok with some type of heat map spotting on the mini map. Or again some way to ping the mini map for my squad/team.

    The way I see it, it is very practical to have your location shown from the sound of a gun. You telling me that if I shot a gun behind you, that you wouldn't know where it came from?

    Are you telling me that if someone shot a gun to the northwest of you, 75-100m away, that you would be able to tell the EXACT location they shot said gun? What about 300m? or 700?

    That's not "practical" at all - there's not a human on this planet that can locate someone's EXACT POSITION from dozens to hundreds of meters away from the sound of a gunshot. You have to remember, that in BF4 you can bring up the "big map" and see blips of people shooting from all the way across the map, no matter how far away from them you are.
    AMEN2THAT wrote: »
    Even if they kept audio spotting the same you'd still be at a sound disadvantage with ear buds because you cant read the direction sounds like footsteps and tank engines are coming from.
    Lmao

    You guys spamming whole threads with "BF is not realistic game and all", now you want us to ear footsteps and all like we playing in some tactical realistic shooter WHILE we actually playing a fast paced arcade game with run-n-spray and vehicles all around and explosions everywhere (and maybe some players are also in VoIP channels or listening music while playing)

    Removing minimap spotting is a realistic feature but yall super happy about it, when its about more historically accurate details that dont affect any1's style to play yall go emo saying BF is not meant to be a realistic game... the fanboysm is strong around here, objectivty = 0

    Listening to footsteps like some tactical shooter? I do the same thing in Call of Duty, Counter Strike, and Overwatch.

    Running up to a corner and hearing footsteps, waiting behind said corner and surprising the guy when you know he's close because you can HEAR him walking is not something that is restricted to "realistic tactical shooters".

    Every FPS game nowadays has audible footsteps that can be used for an advantage. Call of Duty, which is NOT a tactical shooter, has entire MECHANICS built around better hearing footsteps, or not allowing your footsteps to be heard by enemies.

    I mean, your logic is just ridiculous. Implying that we want a "realistic tactical game" just because we wear headphones and can tell to stay away from a certain area because we can hear the direction a tank engine is coming from is absolutely stupid.
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