Weekly BF

Team Balance Issues Ruining Games.

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Comments

  • Tansho
    176 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    That's quite the conspiracy theory. Don't think it's the issue though. This game never really will have balanced games. The balancing system is prevented from breaking up squads, people are allowed to switch teams and quit willy-nilly, and the defective skill system that was in place isn't going to be able to try to work because I would bet now more players are using the server browser than quick match due to trying to find the lowest ping server.
  • SuperHugger
    39 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    Sed1Tion wrote: »
    So a new game starts and the other team has more players than you. It may be one or two players or as much as five or six. Which in Frontlines can be thirty percent more players on the opposing team. I've even seen a game where one team is two players short, two players join and get put one on each team!

    Yes, the teams do eventually become equal in numbers. But only after the game has started and often its to late to turn the tide.

    The disparity in team numbers cant be put down to player skill differences. Would it be that hard to have some proper team balancing before the game starts?

    It's worse than that. There's something fundamentally wrong with balancing.

    For example, a mate of mine loves TDM and keeps getting put on a team mostly consisting of players in a strong platoon with levels all well over 90. The opposition has players mostly under 40. He switches to the other team because he can see how unbalanced it is, versing a low-level non-platoon team. They get slaughtered constantly by up to 70 points a game, which is the most I've ever heard of.

    Every time a new round starts, DICE put him on the platoon team, which now has two high level platoons and him. And the other team is already losing by a disgusting amount. Why?

    I don't see anything wrong with not breaking up a platoon, but why put two high level platoons and individuals against new players. They can't verse the two platoons and evenly spread out the individuals, who are not in parties?

    I think more people should be in platoons, because it's supposed to be a team game. Matchmaking has generally been reasonable. It's seldom I end up on a team that are completely inexperienced, but platoons are introducing a new level of difficulty for matchmaking. It needs to be thought out more.
  • disposalist
    8674 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    @Trokey66

    Well let's take a logical look at this. If the game is balanced and close a Behemoth would upset and over power one side in an unjust manner.

    When a game is balanced and close there is no need for a Behemoth. Only way to make those over hyped marketed kill factories spawn is to have unbalanced servers.

    You can not have behemoths and balanced teams.

    It's one or the other. Not both.
    Behemoth is only really 'useful' if teams are roughly even but things got skewed for some random reason (like early team balance issues). The behemoth can even things in that situation. If one team is just plain worse, then the behemoth is just a bit of fun for the losers - a bad team won't make good use of it.
  • disposalist
    8674 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    How come this got revived in the face of recent similar posts? : -

    Mine
  • Phthinein
    3643 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    How come this got revived in the face of recent similar posts? : -

    Mine

    Because yours is too technical.
    The way to fix it is to split up squads that aren't in parties and limit parties to 5 and instead of filling up the teams in the post game screen it fills up during the pregame screen.
  • SuperHugger
    39 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    How come this got revived in the face of recent similar posts? : -

    Mine

    Because previous threads get lost with the traffic. It's not intentional drawing attention away from existing petitions, and hopefully emphasises the need to review the issue.

    I feel that DICE aren't as attentive to issues as they should be, but more interested in bugs and new features.
  • disposalist
    8674 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    How come this got revived in the face of recent similar posts? : -

    Mine

    Because yours is too technical.
    The way to fix it is to split up squads that aren't in parties and limit parties to 5 and instead of filling up the teams in the post game screen it fills up during the pregame screen.
    I mentioned splitting squads and balancing loading players. I think DICE notice ideas more when they see a thread with multiple pages rather than multiple similar ones. Pretty sure I've seen it mentioned by mods too that it's best to keep ideas on a theme together if you want it taken notice of.

    Actually I just raised the issue on Reddit - relative to Reddit they seem to ignore these official forums anyway.
  • VolatileShifty
    101 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    @Tansho

    I wouldn't really call it a "conspiracy theory" just a flaw in the game mechanics and the idea behind the "turning the tides." We can look at it like an equation.

    Team Skill is Balanced + Score is Close = No Behemoth

    Team Skill isn't Balanced + Score Differential is Huge = Behemoth Spawn

    Like I said when the games are even there is no need for a Behmoth to spawn.

    @disposalist

    I agree the behemoths aware only "useful" in the hands of a talented team. Before these last few patches the I know of two time where behemoths actually turned a game and that was because they were being used by the group I was with and we coordinated with others on the map.

    I honestly believe they ruin the game at its core and are more annoying than anything. I'd like to see Dice release a spawn to win/loss ratio for the behemoths but I doubt they ever will.

    I don't know if they've changed something with the spawn criteria now but I was in a game the other day and it spawned with roughly a 150 score difference which I thought was odd. Kind of frustrating since the opposing team came back and won. Wouldn't have minded if the ticket difference was a bit higher but a 100 - 150 score difference can be turned around with a decent team.
  • Trokey66
    8550 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    @Tansho

    I wouldn't really call it a "conspiracy theory" just a flaw in the game mechanics and the idea behind the "turning the tides." We can look at it like an equation.

    Team Skill is Balanced + Score is Close = No Behemoth

    Team Skill isn't Balanced + Score Differential is Huge = Behemoth Spawn

    Like I said when the games are even there is no need for a Behmoth to spawn.

    @disposalist

    I agree the behemoths aware only "useful" in the hands of a talented team. Before these last few patches the I know of two time where behemoths actually turned a game and that was because they were being used by the group I was with and we coordinated with others on the map.

    I honestly believe they ruin the game at its core and are more annoying than anything. I'd like to see Dice release a spawn to win/loss ratio for the behemoths but I doubt they ever will.

    I don't know if they've changed something with the spawn criteria now but I was in a game the other day and it spawned with roughly a 150 score difference which I thought was odd. Kind of frustrating since the opposing team came back and won. Wouldn't have minded if the ticket difference was a bit higher but a 100 - 150 score difference can be turned around with a decent team.

    I believe 150 has always been the threshold for the Behemoth.
  • DingoKillr
    3677 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    @Tansho

    I wouldn't really call it a "conspiracy theory" just a flaw in the game mechanics and the idea behind the "turning the tides." We can look at it like an equation.

    Team Skill is Balanced + Score is Close = No Behemoth

    Team Skill isn't Balanced + Score Differential is Huge = Behemoth Spawn

    Like I said when the games are even there is no need for a Behmoth to spawn.

    @disposalist

    I agree the behemoths aware only "useful" in the hands of a talented team. Before these last few patches the I know of two time where behemoths actually turned a game and that was because they were being used by the group I was with and we coordinated with others on the map.

    I honestly believe they ruin the game at its core and are more annoying than anything. I'd like to see Dice release a spawn to win/loss ratio for the behemoths but I doubt they ever will.

    I don't know if they've changed something with the spawn criteria now but I was in a game the other day and it spawned with roughly a 150 score difference which I thought was odd. Kind of frustrating since the opposing team came back and won. Wouldn't have minded if the ticket difference was a bit higher but a 100 - 150 score difference can be turned around with a decent team.

    I believe 150 has always been the threshold for the Behemoth.

    That is not always the case. I am no longer sure, only that it is greater than 100. Example on a test server 1 Flag capped on Sinai Behemoth on announced coming after 220 but did not arrive until 280.
  • 3therBunny
    73 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha, Battlefield V Member
    A couple of things; tonight I tried out quick match and it put me on the team that was pinning the other team to their first objective out of their spawn. The dominating team was already up by at least 4-6 players over the losing team. I joined solo queue btw so that was not a factor, you would assume it would put you on the losing team needing the most help but apparently that's not the case.

    One serious gripe I have is allowing team changes to a team that has a sizable lead and already has a few player advantage. Of course you should be able to switch to the team getting rolled but I have seen many times as soon as I join a server and check the scoreboard someone will jump to the other team because I have offset the imbalance limit by one even though the other team is winning and has 2-5 more players on it.
  • disposalist
    8674 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    DingoKillr wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    @Tansho

    I wouldn't really call it a "conspiracy theory" just a flaw in the game mechanics and the idea behind the "turning the tides." We can look at it like an equation.

    Team Skill is Balanced + Score is Close = No Behemoth

    Team Skill isn't Balanced + Score Differential is Huge = Behemoth Spawn

    Like I said when the games are even there is no need for a Behmoth to spawn.

    @disposalist

    I agree the behemoths aware only "useful" in the hands of a talented team. Before these last few patches the I know of two time where behemoths actually turned a game and that was because they were being used by the group I was with and we coordinated with others on the map.

    I honestly believe they ruin the game at its core and are more annoying than anything. I'd like to see Dice release a spawn to win/loss ratio for the behemoths but I doubt they ever will.

    I don't know if they've changed something with the spawn criteria now but I was in a game the other day and it spawned with roughly a 150 score difference which I thought was odd. Kind of frustrating since the opposing team came back and won. Wouldn't have minded if the ticket difference was a bit higher but a 100 - 150 score difference can be turned around with a decent team.

    I believe 150 has always been the threshold for the Behemoth.

    That is not always the case. I am no longer sure, only that it is greater than 100. Example on a test server 1 Flag capped on Sinai Behemoth on announced coming after 220 but did not arrive until 280.
    I think it's always depended on the point in the game. Like it's more than 150 if it's early and more like 100 if it's late.
  • Phthinein
    3643 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    How come this got revived in the face of recent similar posts? : -

    Mine

    Because yours is too technical.
    The way to fix it is to split up squads that aren't in parties and limit parties to 5 and instead of filling up the teams in the post game screen it fills up during the pregame screen.
    I mentioned splitting squads and balancing loading players. I think DICE notice ideas more when they see a thread with multiple pages rather than multiple similar ones. Pretty sure I've seen it mentioned by mods too that it's best to keep ideas on a theme together if you want it taken notice of.

    Actually I just raised the issue on Reddit - relative to Reddit they seem to ignore these official forums anyway.

    Good.
    Honestly if the next map didn't load the teams in the post-game screen things would get mostly fixed.
  • RVDfor20
    190 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    3therBunny wrote: »
    A couple of things; tonight I tried out quick match and it put me on the team that was pinning the other team to their first objective out of their spawn. The dominating team was already up by at least 4-6 players over the losing team. I joined solo queue btw so that was not a factor, you would assume it would put you on the losing team needing the most help but apparently that's not the case.

    One serious gripe I have is allowing team changes to a team that has a sizable lead and already has a few player advantage. Of course you should be able to switch to the team getting rolled but I have seen many times as soon as I join a server and check the scoreboard someone will jump to the other team because I have offset the imbalance limit by one even though the other team is winning and has 2-5 more players on it.

    This ^ so much. Happens all the time where it balances according to skill rather than even the numbers first. It could be 10 v 7 and yet the next two players are added to the team with 10 players already...speaking of pigeon game mode, making it 12 v 7. And its not because there are players still loading in for the other team. The system is broken.
  • WarCriminal_954
    636 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V Member
    this is not a new problem! i have complained for about a year and a half and has only recently gained attention by others. it used to be worse too btw. on BF4 Rush for example, players attack, then defend on each map. we were often stuck on the attacking side or defending side 10 times in a row!

    about mid-life BF4 they introduced "skill-based matchmaking" which may have sounded good on paper but in reality is this horrible mess we see today. this was their solution to the many complaints about one-sided matches! the result...more one-sided matches!
  • Trokey66
    8550 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE, Battlefield V Member
    DingoKillr wrote: »
    Trokey66 wrote: »
    @Tansho

    I wouldn't really call it a "conspiracy theory" just a flaw in the game mechanics and the idea behind the "turning the tides." We can look at it like an equation.

    Team Skill is Balanced + Score is Close = No Behemoth

    Team Skill isn't Balanced + Score Differential is Huge = Behemoth Spawn

    Like I said when the games are even there is no need for a Behmoth to spawn.

    @disposalist

    I agree the behemoths aware only "useful" in the hands of a talented team. Before these last few patches the I know of two time where behemoths actually turned a game and that was because they were being used by the group I was with and we coordinated with others on the map.

    I honestly believe they ruin the game at its core and are more annoying than anything. I'd like to see Dice release a spawn to win/loss ratio for the behemoths but I doubt they ever will.

    I don't know if they've changed something with the spawn criteria now but I was in a game the other day and it spawned with roughly a 150 score difference which I thought was odd. Kind of frustrating since the opposing team came back and won. Wouldn't have minded if the ticket difference was a bit higher but a 100 - 150 score difference can be turned around with a decent team.

    I believe 150 has always been the threshold for the Behemoth.

    That is not always the case. I am no longer sure, only that it is greater than 100. Example on a test server 1 Flag capped on Sinai Behemoth on announced coming after 220 but did not arrive until 280.

    Can't be 100% certain but deffo in the ball park.

    The 50 ticket difference could be explained by the amount of time it can take to actually deploy from when it is first announced.
  • r0nin_Ts
    1410 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, CTE Member
    edited May 2017
    *Deleted*
    Post edited by r0nin_Ts on
  • Sed1Tion
    341 postsMember, Battlefield, Battlefield 1, BF1IncursionsAlpha Member
    Even team numbers would be a good starting point. I often now leave games before they start if the team numbers are to far apart. You just know how those games are going to turn out. Even if you do manage to hold out until the numbers are more even the game is often lost.
  • NitroBullet300
    60 postsMember, Battlefield 3, Battlefield 4, Battlefield Hardline, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    The balance seem fine on PS4. What I see is alot of CoD style player that don't work as a team. If my team get thier butts handed to them it because everyone is out for themselves. No team play I see the winning team spawning on each other capping flags etc look at the end screen it tells you how many squad spawns and flags capped if your team has less that's why you lost.
  • sam0705_2
    17 postsMember, Battlefield 4, Battlefield, Battlefield 1 Member
    I just finished a round of Rush on PS4 and it was horribly unbalanced player numbers. We were attacking with 5 v 12 and it was just a waste of time because we only detonated one bomb. I can't understand how DICE's system can allow this to happen. 5 v 12 is ridiculous. Surely players are allocated to each side in somewhat of an even manner? This occurring ruined the round and left me rather angry at DICE, it shouldn't happen. How hard is it for DICE to get their S*** sorted with allocating even team numbers?
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